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Totte

Tottes Mcburnie daytona pro touring build

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i have always dream about owning a MV daytona since i saw the series 7 years old 

2 years ago i was starting to look at some cars and was getting in contact with  miamispyders and he had a red one i liked, very hard to see from pics if a car is good since i live in sweden

but i was buying it and had him to make it black and change the interior

he was very good to deal with so i cant complain with that,but the work of the paint and interior was not soo good that i was hopping for

but it works for now!

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how it looks now!

my garage build is getting toughter soo im looking forward to strip the car a bit under this winter

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Nice :)

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what kind of help do you need for information, and what are you shooting for performance and handling wise?

 

and exterior wise? more oversteer (tail slides out) understeer (front responds less) as theres kind of a formula to all of it really, its one of the reasons why the germans seem to make the best, as they always focus on the mathimatical formulas of performance and handling.

 

plus they travel long distances with their cars, and faults that would not normally show up on town and the occasional highway driving would in long distance travels, and typically with pro touring builds those faults do show up.

 

plus the more comfortable the driver is when racing, the better he performs, its one of the keys about endurance racing that often gets overlooked.

 

also a possible person you could talk to about this, mind you the phone bill might be abit much is Gulstrand, Dick Gulstrand who has a performance shop in california, you could email him and ask him or his associates about what would be needed, as he's a former corvette racer, and has hands on experence with the C3 generation

 

 

 

 

also with the modifications I would look at them as stages, Stage 1, Stage 2, Stage 3, as the key to consistancey in the winners circle is getting everything well set up and just the way you want it, kind of like setting up a match pistol, it has to be perfectly balanced to your body and what you want to do, or how you drive in this case.

 

although its very easy to overdo things, so its one of the keys of the stages things, simple easy mods at first, then as you learn and grow with the car, the mods get bigger.

 

and who knows maybe with some very minor changes your very happy with it as is, and so be it, no need to reinvent the wheel then.

Edited by Kavinsky

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its going to be a modern engine and drive train

because my plan is to drive a race called modball its a gumball without the rich folks:-)

and it goes from sweden to monaco

and i had plans before of building a camaro 68 rs pro touring but now it has been done here in sweden soo then my old boy dream remind me

soo its going to be similar stuff like Hotchkis has on the suspension but im reading up on corvette parts

first i had a plan of buy a wrecked corvette c5 or c6  and lift over the body but they are soo much wider

soo i think the best way is to get a new engine and drive train too fit in the old c3 frame insteed and buy after market parts for c3 suspension

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Some interior pics

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what's the engine bay look like and what is she packing as is. as a few minor mods might all be what's needed.

 

and the C5 switched over to a Trans axel design, so if your going to swap or use parts off of a corvette its going to have to be a C4, as the Vice cars might have been using those parts to modernise them and bring them up to spec during the show runs, as the C4 was just a rebodied and updated C3, with its main updates being a new rack and pinion steering system, a leaf spring on the front suspension that acted as anti roll bar and updated disc brakes

 

in addition to using a proper fuel injected motor.

 

so engine wise it might be wise to use the same motor that was used in this beast, the LS1, as the camaro versions probably still used the traditional Engine Transmision layout

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_small-block_engine#LS1

 

also this has shown up on my radar, its the only one that Willcox corvette actually has for suspension modifications

 

http://www.speeddirect.com/index.php/suspension/corvette-shark-bite

 

plus the spacer/monte carlo bar is probably a must frankly, as all shelby's had them, and the bigger the engine bay the less bracing theres going to be in there on the older cars.

 

so all you have is the suspension below, and nothing onto to stiffen that area, yet in every modern motor its either a small enough engine that that doesnt matter or it has one or something close.

 

and there is also this

http://www.vetteworksonline.net/catalog/index.php?cPath=20&osCsid=u8j61ppavgd8isk5c2789ptsj5

http://vetteworksonline.net/6873%20harness%20bar.htm

 

 

and this to think about

 

 

1982 Vs 1985, the second far more than the first year of the C4

 

 

but the 1989 is the real sweet spot of them, as Tom Falconer in his Corvette books pointed out that of all the C4's the 1989's were the best reliability wise, and the 300 HP engine they came out with for them back then, which this one is using

 

 

http://corvette.canney.net/webvettes/customized/c0050/index.html

 

was a real get up and goer with the LT1 motor

 

 

 

so those might be the two motors to look for, and the Tremic 5 speed.

 

 

Safety wise I would have the frame checked over given the cars age in the weight bearing areas, just to be safe and sure, and have a battery disconnect installed somewhere, along with having the fuel and oil hoses checked over to make sure their up to snuff as is if the motors one that's worth keeping

 

and also have the fuse box looked over just incase, as sometimes people do dogy things with aftermarket stereos, and a spare fuse or two is not a bad thing to have along, and if its got an imobalizer check the age over, as typically those things do go as they get older along with any electronics

 

and also there is this to think of

 

 

 

also rims and tires, the bigger the rim, the more brake you can fit in, and with the tires you want to make sure the speed rating lines up with what the car is going to be doing, plus it wouldnt be a bad idea to look the rims over and make sure their all in good nick, and if you go for wires, have them rigged up with safety wire or bolts.

Edited by Kavinsky

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but the main thing I would think is that you want to set up the shocks and ride height properly for the intended purpose, as demonstrated here

 

 

and just try and tweak things a little better, as sometimes some simple mods like an updated ignition, and new catalitic converters, as the old ones from the 1980's were garbage will do wonders to the performance and capability of the car

 

 

plus sometimes with the brakes theres little tricks you can do to get them better than what they were, although if you dyno it might be a good idea to take the hood off and put some pads on the sides, as panels are hard to find for these cars.

 

 

 

heat and cooling wise a new radiator or boil out your old one and maybe some new electric fans, but I dont know the car and how well it drives so this is all up to you what you want to do.

 

full monte wise these are good videos in those regards.

Edited by Kavinsky

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also for air con if that's on the list, vintage air seems to be the people to go with, and this guy has a 550 HP C3 with a 454 that I've been following for awhile, he hasnt done many videos on it but he knows his stuff and he could be an invaluable resource

 

 

also as a private idea, I had thought that maybe this mod he did to the windshield on this one at 9:40

 

 

would work for the daytona

 

gallery_471_5_735794.jpg

 

I modded the photo on the left to lower it abit, and might really set off your pro street one, and they did modify the steering wheel on the C4's from the C3's at a 66 Degree angle.

Edited by Kavinsky

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also this showed up today and they talk about all the key things that are needed for fast track times with it

 

 

which fills in the blanks about the CLK GTR, as I remember seeing that live back in the day and wondering what the hell just happened?!

 

plus that thing about having vents to reduce the air pressure around the tire, I remember there was some special camaro racecar that did that back in the day, although I cant remember who's

 

and that's where not having wheel arches on the replicas might be a good thing, although the key with the underbelly is to reduce anything the air can get stuck on so it reduces lift and resistance,

 

 

 

and the area behind the grill might be one of those areas, as I forget the specifics of it but Jurrasic had done something behind the grill to reduce the front end lift he was having, also I know of a racing C3 454 that had that kind of duct work put in to cool its brakes like it does on the TR there, mind you it didnt have wire wheels.

 

also its worth noting that the TR is a dry sump motor, where the dry sump sits ontop of the motor to remove that oil pan on the bottom to clean up that space, apparently earlier V8's can be modified to this system, the trade off is that the warm up time is much longer and if its been sitting you want to have something like the roadkill guy talked about there with the distrubutor, and you might be relying more on the pump than you would than on the normal V8

 

plus there is what Mike Musto talked about on his charger here at 8:29, although you might want to start at 7:22

 

 

that could easily take the place of that without reinventing the wheel, although he might want to look into a bigger fuel tank or a carb with a vacume secondary with that kind of mileage.

 

also the Corvette that might be the best to look for for inspiration is probably the C4 ZR1, and with the C4's in general they switched to a 4 link suspension setup in 1984, plus for the 1978 revision of the car the leaf springs on the back were changed and moderinzed, possibly to better deal with radial tires since they started to really catch on in 1975

 

although some of the big block cars and the perfomance models had an uprated suspension, such as the L82 and some of the big blocks had a 5 piece I think, you kind of have to look through the history to pick and Choose but there is a guy in England who can probably help you

 

Tom falconer, he still has a shop up there and apparently he was insturmental in helping them get parts for the ZR1 project when lotus was building it for GM, plus his books on the C2, C3 and C4 are very helpful, and I have yet to get his one on the C1, but given some outragious claim that apparently one of them was capable of a 150, I'm kind of curious to see if theres any truth to that.

1960 Corvette 150 MPH claimed, 2900 pounds
270 HP Dual Quad 283 New Tach, Bigger Radiator
RP0 684? RPO 579

Source MSN Unrestored Survivor 1960 Corvette?

 

From My own Personal Notes, I have a huge note file on caculations and parts that I've learned about over the years.

 

 

plus that whole adjustable magnetic shock thing with the C5's and onwards was originally a Lotus thing, and when Lotus was bought out by GM they got that technology from them.

 

 

 

and then dumped them more or less,

 

but basically one of the best things you can do right now is adjust the ride height, put the thing on a lift and see if anything is worn or loose by just yanking on it, and drive it and then a different C3 to see if anything feels different in a bad way.

 

then fix those problems and then work on the things like a system.

 

 

Performance wise: Exhaust, the Catalitic Converter, replace with a more modern unit if its old, Test to make sure its properly tuned to run on the higher and better octanes of Europe, Check the alternator, the Battery, also an acidless battery like a gel battery used on a boat could be a good idea

 

http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/extras/car-parts/agm-spiral-cell-car-batteries/
 

 

and the spark plugs to make sure their running with good ignition

 

and there was something on Willcox about the headlamp wires and some weird and easy way to make them brighter if that shows up somewhere.

 

and the radiator, if its overheating, or running too hot check that and the electric fans, as it can be a good idea to also do that and switch to waterless engine coolant if you have any serious aluminumn work in the motor and the car sits for a long time

 

in addition to an ethanol stablizer if you have that stuff over there

 

 

as ethanol and water, it really eats at Alumiumn for whatever reason, I'm not sure if its just in general more corrosive towards it

 

and if its carbed, sometimes a simple carb change can really make it perform

 

plus it might be a good idea to look into the gas tank and see if they have any with bladders for the hardcore racing with a carbed car, I think stock it maybe an 18 gallon tank

 

 

Suspension wise, check over the shocks, the bushings if theres a rumble, anti roll bars/leaf springs to make sure everythings nice and tight

 

and for the brakes there might be a cheap alternative to them, EBR Yellowstuff Brake pads, such as what Harry Metcalf used on these two cars

 

 

and there in england apparently, so its not like you'd be buying direct from the US with those huge shipping costs, as them and Tom Falconer who runs an ebay shop that I've found would be your best bets to my knowledge on that side of the world.

 

 

as it apparently increased the braking by some huge amount just based on the pads, and there is a handbrake upgrade thing you can apparently get, possibly here somewhere

 

http://www.ecklers.com/

http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/at-the-garage/corvette/corvette-parking-brake-kit/
 

 

 

also Tirewise I have heard some very good things about Michelin Pilot Sports, such as it being run on this C5 and this BRZ

 

 

the daytona in the show however was using Pirelli's, but in an ironic twist back then they ran Michelin's on ferrari's in europe, so those are the two to go with

 

hell even the new Volkswaggen Sport waggon is running Pirelli's apparently, much to my suprise nowadays

 

however I would make sure to go for something that doesnt have a square profile, as it ruins the look of the car,

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFKxEcQ3r7k

 

you want to aim for a rounded one, and the pilot sports are more of a summer tire from what I understand, and generally the Pirelli's are more of a harder compound so they last longer, the Mitch's are softer

 

and sometimes all you need to do to make a car handle better is new tires and maybe a different steering wheel and rack and pinion steering from a C4

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XD-pzw5DNS0

 

this ones abit worn though I think.

 

and also this for the ethanol, it might be something you could get locally.

https://twitter.com/harrym_evo/status/544574150975959041

 

 

plus actually if you want to talk to someone who kind of has a semi pro stock build, Sonny Burnett would be the person to talk to in a way as what someone did with his when they ordered it was they overhauled the rear suspension and possibly other components, possibly at Dick Gulstrands place, as theres a photo of Dick with a C4 based daytona replica that I've come across, plus the Mcburnie factory was in california and possibly closely located to his shop.

 

and then they drove the nuts off of it, resulting in him making some basic repairs and upgrades, such as fixing the engine mounts, switching the cooling fan the right way around, and putting on a new carb, hence why I made that big deal about checking everything over and making basic reliability and minor upgrades

 

as sometimes that's all these cars need to really shine, I mean we're not talking about some 2001 Oldsmobile that was designed to fall apart at 80, and proceeded to do so at 40, like what happened to my fathers car

 

yet the old style body on chasis wagon 1996 olds Ciera that was older, that they had basically been building since 1984 outlasted it and would have kept going if I had kept it up and looked after it, plus that mother would fly and took a beating.

 

as I think I wore out 3 sets of tires with it, atleast.

 

and its part of the reason why this particular pro stock build always resonated with me, as I kinda wish I could have saved it and turned it into something like this

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_-eAP_CTHM

 

although I kept the rear view mirror as a keepsake the day it went to the junkers, and someday I'll put it on my own daytona.

 

and never underestimate the capability of an empty wagon designed to haul around people, as those things with no body in fly.

Edited by Kavinsky

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also I must add to build on what mike musto said there about just turning the key and enjoying the car,

 

 

there is Vlnyl bodywraps and other ways to protect the paint now

 

 

 

 

 

that way if you sit on it or bump into it when looking over the engine compartment, or grab the door handle or the door wrong, you dont end up scratching it, and you dont go insane about it

 

and if you do well theres this miracle worker in england

 

https://twitter.com/perfectionvalet

 

and then all you have to worry about is just making sure you dont drive it in a crap hole or somewhere where the bad people are, like around a Liquor Store here in the US, as drugs are always a bad scene, regardless if their legal or not here in the US or take it to a mall/ anyplace where kids, teenagers namely hang out on fridays

Edited by Kavinsky

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Hey tottes I was just reading through Chevy High performance this month, and a car in particular grabbed my eye, the story is called Hard Candy, with a heavily modded Chevelle and the guy talks about all this main stuff he did to it and he says something rather interesting

 

he has this 400 + CI motor, 7 Liters producing 600 some HP, and he wishes he had just gone with a 400 some horsepower LS3 motor, 376 CI, the same as the C2 grandsport actually with about the same HP

 

Mild with Air conditioning, much like Corvette Ben wants to do with his 600 HP car in that respect actually, and that motor here runs on 92 Octane with 429 HP and 400 some FT pounds of torque, factory, no mods, double about what the C3 had in 1981, and about 1/3rd more powerful than a stock big block in its heyday, and you can get them direct from Chevy as a crate motor, or the motor out of a 2008 - onwards C6 Corvette/ Camaro

 

 

and that might be the way to go, as that's TWO people who have said that a milder motor and air con was better than going all out, along with the appropriate transmision, LSD and gears for it

 

 

then my personal recommendation would be to stiffen the chasis with the spreader bar from speed direct, an anti roll bar on the front, maybe look into their independant suspension kit, as the biggest weakness of cars from that era comes right down to the stiffening of the chasis, along with the suspension geometry that comes along with it, as if you can get that set up right, then the rest is easy.

 

as Cowl Shake is a big concern with cars of this age, and that all comes down to the monte carlo/spreader bar, and the proper crossmemeber bracing along the chasis itself.

 

 

so that and coil overs to adjust it properly to the weight the car is carrying.

 

 

and maybe switch it over to a rack and pinion set up from them or off of a Corvette C4

 

look into maybe making some duct work to direct air onto the brakes, as to cool them, and look into some modern replacement ones, the EBC ones seem to be a good catch all next to the brembo and braer ones, with a proper master clyinder for them, or use the period racing stye of rebalancing them to be 50/50

 

and then stick on some properly rated pirelli or michelen tires on it, which might honestly be the best first step, and then just work from there, and do some autocross or speed tests to see if you need to work in some sort of flat plates or skidplates into the car to reduce air resistance, or some extra tubing to redirect the air from the trouble spots.

 

as all the difference is between a Ferrari and a Corvette is the attention to detail and the engineering worked into it, and power without control, while it may be fun, it doesnt provide a consistant and predictable racer, and ferrari's were always racecars for the road

 

 

just look at the draguar vs the stock 1993 one, and it vs the stock V12 if its tuned up and rigged up right, now imagine all 3 on a road course

 

 

I think Mr Blue here would win.

 

but imagine your car as that Jag, vs the draguar, and that is the way I would spin this, as everything is about balance and attention to detail.

 

and the simplest things you can do first, is regular maintenance/tuning as is to get the thing running well, like look over the bushing bearings, check the spark and the wires, and check over the frame to make sure everything looks good and the welds are good, check over the gears and diff and make sure the shocks are set up properly for the cars weight.

 

along with making sure the brakes are good as well, using that video I showed you.

 

and if you have bias ply tires on it, god only knows why it would have those, change those over to radial tires that are properly rated for about a 130 to 140 MPH. Goodyear, Cooper radial tires would be good starting points, and make sure there rigged up to take the right weight for the car.

 

but just focus on those things first and go from there, a checklist for sure but if you follow a checklist, you'll never miss a key step, hence why even in this age of modern tech, they always use a physical one for aircraft, although forrays into the era of stupidty have caused them to look into making that digital

 

with bad results, such as grounding an entire aircraft because the thing went offline, but keep it simple and use what's around you, and sometimes somethings can be better and cheaper for it just because of that.

 

although brakes/brake cooling and the tires would be my foremost concern, as you can brake and drive faster with better tires and well cooled brakes, as I know of a GTO that was used in germany during the 1960's that beat the crap out of a BMW, save for the fact that the brakes overheated, as it had no vents to cool them down, like the testarossa has, hence its blocky bumper, and the vents along the side, and it was using the disc drum setup.

 

although to be fair, I think the daytona didnt have them either, although I dont know for sure, I just know that this blue one boiled its brakes at a track day once

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/darylchapman/12715182164/

 

nart blue before you ask

Edited by Kavinsky

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