OBAMACARE

[Frey]

What happens when health care, and everything else goes bankrupt?What happens then?

We lose our tripple A bond rating, China stops buying bonds to fund our debt, and we go into total Freefall. Might as well change the name of the country to Costa Morada. :cry:

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Freefall. Might as well change the name of the country to Costa Morada. :cry:

Realisticlly, it won't happen for many years, but that is the direction that it is going.I wish the President hadn't quadtupled our national debt in one year of being on the job. He's bankrupting us. It's too bad some people are in denial of this, however, slowly, people are waking up. November is eight months away.

[jcm8002204]

Well, regardless of the polling data, the bill was passed...the methods used were parliamentary and the resulting ramifications to the economy will be felt, unemployment will, at best remain unchanged...however watch for 'employment numbers' to improve as the Census will show a 700k add over the next several months....seriously...anything to boost the numbers up.It should be telling that even with a majority in both houses, the bill took over a year to pass, and even then, the backroom deals are no longer under the veil of winks and favors.This may torque off some members, but here goes: The USA has freed most of Western Europe not once, but twice….twice…WWI & WWII…and given all the land back..…excepting for the tiny parcels we requested to bury the US Soldiers that died there, freeing those countries…. We spearheaded the rebuilding of the countries that were vanquished in the process. Yes, wars are brutal, things are broken, people die…some innocent, more not. Freedom isn’t free. That’s the difference between the USA and every other country.This is the 1st time in our short history that a citizen will be forced to purchase a service or product by its government…it goes completely against the simple freedoms in the founding documents.You are free to work in the industry of your choosing….free to fail as well…. There are so many opportunities here in the USA.The USA’s opportunities and ingenuity has been a benefit to the world over, especially related to health, and healthcare: medicines, medical devices, and surgical techniques, crop production, genetics, diagnostics, prevention, and list goes on and on and on…..and just think that we’re not even 250 years into this freedom experiment….This bill, as written, WILL STIFLE the R&D (Research & Development) of these and more….It will drive up costs and limit services. More jobs will be off-shored due to costs and the absence of logical malpractice liabilities anywhere in the bill.An important note to you…if you’ve made it this far:This bill also exempts the President and Congress from the ‘healthcare exchanges’ that they are forcing on everyone else…….think about that….THEY’VE EXEMPTED THEMSELVES in order to allow them to go outside the system they’ve put in to law, and continue with their status quo.This Fall, I am confident that the political choices will be different, and there will be more of a balance of power swept in….Peace Out.

[maynard]

Well' date=' regardless of the polling data, the bill was passed...the methods used were parliamentary and the resulting ramifications to the economy will be felt, unemployment will, at best remain unchanged...however watch for 'employment numbers' to improve as the Census will show a 700k add over the next several months....seriously...anything to boost the numbers up.It should be telling that even with a majority in both houses, the bill took over a year to pass, and even then, the backroom deals are no longer under the veil of winks and favors.This may torque off some members, but here goes: The USA has freed most of Western Europe not once, but twice….twice…WWI & WWII…and given all the land back..…excepting for the tiny parcels we requested to bury the US Soldiers that died there, freeing those countries…. We spearheaded the rebuilding of the countries that were vanquished in the process. Yes, wars are brutal, things are broken, people die…some innocent, more not. Freedom isn’t free. That’s the difference between the USA and every other country.This is the 1st time in our short history that a citizen will be forced to purchase a service or product by its government…it goes completely against the simple freedoms in the founding documents.You are free to work in the industry of your choosing….free to fail as well…. There are so many opportunities here in the USA.The USA’s opportunities and ingenuity has been a benefit to the world over, especially related to health, and healthcare: medicines, medical devices, and surgical techniques, crop production, genetics, diagnostics, prevention, and list goes on and on and on…..and just think that we’re not even 250 years into this freedom experiment….This bill, as written, WILL STIFLE the R&D (Research & Development) of these and more….It will drive up costs and limit services. More jobs will be off-shored due to costs and the absence of logical malpractice liabilities anywhere in the bill.An important note to you…if you’ve made it this far:This bill also exempts the President and Congress from the ‘healthcare exchanges’ that they are forcing on everyone else…….think about that….THEY’VE EXEMPTED THEMSELVES in order to allow them to go outside the system they’ve put in to law, and continue with their status quo.This Fall, I am confident that the political choices will be different, and there will be more of a balance of power swept in….Peace Out.[/quote']Ju got it Mang!!!

[Frey]

Ju got it Mang!!!

Ditto! Excellent post jcm! :clap:This just in:Fidel Castro Endorses Obamacarehttp://finance.yahoo.com/news/Cuban-leader-applauds-US-apf-124808403.html?x=0&.v=1

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Ditto! Excellent post jcm! :clap:This just in:Fidel Castro Endorses Obamacarehttp://finance.yahoo.com/news/Cuban-leader-applauds-US-apf-124808403.html?x=0&.v=1

People, you KNOW when Dictator Fidel Castro endorces this bill.....it ain't good. :thumbsdown:I wonder when Presidential Dictator Hugo Chavez of Venezuela (Sean Penn's buddy, and the guy whom Obama bumped fists with) will sing his praises for this bill. After all, he want's nothing but the best for Americans.Great link Frey.

[Frey]

From the article: "It's really incredible that 234 years after the Declaration of Independence... the government of that country has approved medical attention for the majority of its citizens, something Cuba was able to do half a century ago."Hey Fidel, Obama,Pelosi,Chavez, and all other socialists/marxists/communists:It's called the Declaration of INDEPENDENCE, NOT the Declaration of DEPENDENCE.

[jcm8002204]

AN IMPORTANT NOTE TO YOU…IF YOU’VE MADE IT THIS FARTHIS BILL EXEMPTS THE PRESIDENT AND CONGRESS FROM PARTICIPATION IN THE ‘HEALTHCARE EXCHANGES’ THAT THEY ARE FORCING ON EVERYONE ELSE…….THINK ABOUT THAT….THEY’VE EXEMPTED THEMSELVES IN ORDER TO ALLOW THEM TO GO OUTSIDE THE SYSTEM THEY’VE PUT IN TO LAW, AND CONTINUE WITH THEIR STATUS QUO.NOVEMBER CAN'T COME FAST ENOUGH...

[jcm8002204]

MY FONT SIZE SELECTION ABOVE WAS PURPOSEFULSee the New Amendment:“Congress shall make no law that applies to the citizens of the United States that does not apply equally to the Senators and/or Representatives; and, Congress shall make no law that applies to the Senators and/or Representatives that does not apply equally to the citizens of the United States.â€

[jcm8002204]

The percieved Right to HealthCare reminds me of the recently laidoff persons that seem to be all too eager to complain to the camera 'I gave this company 23 years, and then they lay me off' montra, of course played over and over and over....Here is a great piece: A letter from the BOSSI started this company 28 years ago. At that time, I lived in a 300 square foot studio apartment for 3 years. My entire living apartment wasconverted into an office so I could put forth 100% effort into building a company, which by the way, would eventually employ you.My diet consisted of Ramen Pride noodles because every dollar I spent went back into this company. I drove a rusty Toyota Corolla with a defective transmission. I didn’t have time to date. Often times, I stayed home on weekends, while my friends went out drinking and partying. In fact, I was married to my business — hard work, discipline, and sacrifice.Meanwhile, my friends got jobs. They worked 40 hours a week and made a modest $50K a year and spent every dime they earned. They drove flashy cars and lived in expensive homes and wore fancy designer clothes. Instead of hitting the Nordstrom’s for the latest hot fashion item, I was trolling through the discount store extracting any clothing item that didn’t look like it was birthed in the 70’s. My friends refinanced their mortgages and lived a life of luxury. I, however, did not. I put my time, my money, and my life into a business with a vision that eventually, some day, I too, will be able to afford these luxuries my friends supposedly had.So, while you physically arrive at the office at 9am, mentally check in at about noon, and then leave at 5pm, I don’t. There is no “off†button for me.When you leave the office, you are done and you have a weekend all to yourself. I unfortunately do not have the freedom. I eat, and breathethis company every minute of the day. There is no rest. There is no weekend. There is no happy hour. Every day this business is attached to my hip like a 1 year old special-needs child. You, of course, only see the fruits of that garden — the nice house, the Cadillac, the vacations… you never realize the back story and the sacrifices I’ve made.Now, the economy is falling apart and I, the guy that made all the right decisions and saved his money, have to bail-out all the people whodidn’t. The people that overspent their paychecks suddenly feel entitled to the same luxuries that I earned and sacrificed a decade of my life for.Yes, business ownership has is benefits but the price I’ve paid is steep and not without wounds.Unfortunately, the cost of running this business, and employing you, is starting to eclipse the threshold of marginal benefit and let me tell you why:I am being taxed to death and the government thinks I don’t pay enough. I have state taxes. Federal taxes. Property taxes. Sales and use taxes. Payroll taxes. Workers compensation taxes. Unemployment taxes. Taxes on taxes. I have to hire a tax man to manage all these taxes and then guess what? I have to pay taxes for employing him. Government mandates and regulations and all the accounting that goes with it, now occupy most of my time. On Oct 15th, I wrote a check to the US Treasury for $288,000 for quarterly taxes. You know what my “stimulus†check was? Zero. Nada. Zilch.The question I have is this: Who is stimulating the economy? Me, the guy who has provided 14 people good paying jobs and serves over 2,200,000 people per year with a flourishing business? Or, the single mother sitting at home pregnant with her fourth child waiting for her next welfare check?Obviously, government feels the latter is the economic stimulus of this country.The fact is, if I deducted (Read: Stole) 50% of your paycheck you’d quit and you wouldn’t work here. I mean, why should you? That’s nuts. Who wants to get rewarded only 50% of their hard work? Well, I agree which is why your job is in jeopardy.Here is what many of you don’t understand … to stimulate the economy you need to stimulate what runs the economy. Had suddenly government mandated to me that I didn’t need to pay taxes, guess what? Instead of depositing that $288,000 into the Washington black-hole, I would have spent it, hired more employees, and generated substantial economic growth. My employees would have enjoyed the wealth of that tax cut in the form of promotions and better salaries. But you can forget it now.When you have a comatose man on the verge of death, you don’t defibrillate and shock his thumb thinking that will bring him back to life, do you?Or, do you defibrillate his heart? Business is at the heart of America and always has been. To restart it, you must stimulate it, not kill it.Suddenly, the power brokers in Washington believe the poor of America are the essential drivers of the American economic engine. Nothing could be further from the truth and this is the type of change you can keep.So where am I going with all this?It’s quite simple.If any new taxes are levied on me, or my company, my reaction will be swift and simple. I fire you. I fire your co-workers. You can then plead with the government to pay for your mortgage, your SUV, and your child’s future.Frankly, it isn’t my problem any more.Then, I will close this company down, move to another country, and retire. You see, I’m done. I’m done with a country that penalizes the productive and gives to the unproductive. My motivation to work and to provide jobs will bedestroyed, and with it, will be my citizenship.So, if you lose your job, it won’t be at the hands of the economy; it will be at the hands of a political hurricane that swept through thiscountry, steamrolled the constitution, and will have changed its landscape forever. If that happens, you can find me sitting on a beach, retired, and with no employees to worry about….Signed,Your boss

[COOPER&BURNETT]

THIS BILL EXEMPTS THE PRESIDENT AND CONGRESS FROM PARTICIPATION IN THE ‘HEALTHCARE EXCHANGES’ THAT THEY ARE FORCING ON EVERYONE ELSE…….THINK ABOUT THAT….THEY’VE EXEMPTED THEMSELVES IN ORDER TO ALLOW THEM TO GO OUTSIDE THE SYSTEM THEY’VE PUT IN TO LAW' date=' AND CONTINUE WITH THEIR STATUS QUO.[/b']NOVEMBER CAN'T COME FAST ENOUGH...

Ditto.

[DJAngel]

Fact Check: Members of Congress and Health Care Reformhttp://www.startribune.com/blogs/89041877.html?elr=KArks7PYDiaK7DUHPYDiaK7DUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUU

[timm525]

The percieved Right to HealthCare reminds me of the recently laidoff persons that seem to be all too eager to complain to the camera 'I gave this company 23 years' date=' and then they lay me off' montra, of course played over and over and over....Here is a great piece: A letter from the BOSSI started this company 28 years ago. At that time, I lived in a 300 square foot studio apartment for 3 years. My entire living apartment wasconverted into an office so I could put forth 100% effort into building a company, which by the way, would eventually employ you.My diet consisted of Ramen Pride noodles because every dollar I spent went back into this company. I drove a rusty Toyota Corolla with a defective transmission. I didn’t have time to date. Often times, I stayed home on weekends, while my friends went out drinking and partying. In fact, I was married to my business — hard work, discipline, and sacrifice.Meanwhile, my friends got jobs. They worked 40 hours a week and made a modest $50K a year and spent every dime they earned. They drove flashy cars and lived in expensive homes and wore fancy designer clothes. Instead of hitting the Nordstrom’s for the latest hot fashion item, I was trolling through the discount store extracting any clothing item that didn’t look like it was birthed in the 70’s. My friends refinanced their mortgages and lived a life of luxury. I, however, did not. I put my time, my money, and my life into a business with a vision that eventually, some day, I too, will be able to afford these luxuries my friends supposedly had.So, while you physically arrive at the office at 9am, mentally check in at about noon, and then leave at 5pm, I don’t. There is no “off” button for me.When you leave the office, you are done and you have a weekend all to yourself. I unfortunately do not have the freedom. I eat, and breathethis company every minute of the day. There is no rest. There is no weekend. There is no happy hour. Every day this business is attached to my hip like a 1 year old special-needs child. You, of course, only see the fruits of that garden — the nice house, the Cadillac, the vacations… you never realize the back story and the sacrifices I’ve made.Now, the economy is falling apart and I, the guy that made all the right decisions and saved his money, have to bail-out all the people whodidn’t. The people that overspent their paychecks suddenly feel entitled to the same luxuries that I earned and sacrificed a decade of my life for.Yes, business ownership has is benefits but the price I’ve paid is steep and not without wounds.Unfortunately, the cost of running this business, and employing you, is starting to eclipse the threshold of marginal benefit and let me tell you why:I am being taxed to death and the government thinks I don’t pay enough. I have state taxes. Federal taxes. Property taxes. Sales and use taxes. Payroll taxes. Workers compensation taxes. Unemployment taxes. Taxes on taxes. I have to hire a tax man to manage all these taxes and then guess what? I have to pay taxes for employing him. Government mandates and regulations and all the accounting that goes with it, now occupy most of my time. On Oct 15th, I wrote a check to the US Treasury for $288,000 for quarterly taxes. You know what my “stimulus” check was? Zero. Nada. Zilch.The question I have is this: Who is stimulating the economy? Me, the guy who has provided 14 people good paying jobs and serves over 2,200,000 people per year with a flourishing business? Or, the single mother sitting at home pregnant with her fourth child waiting for her next welfare check?Obviously, government feels the latter is the economic stimulus of this country.The fact is, if I deducted (Read: Stole) 50% of your paycheck you’d quit and you wouldn’t work here. I mean, why should you? That’s nuts. Who wants to get rewarded only 50% of their hard work? Well, I agree which is why your job is in jeopardy.Here is what many of you don’t understand … to stimulate the economy you need to stimulate what runs the economy. Had suddenly government mandated to me that I didn’t need to pay taxes, guess what? Instead of depositing that $288,000 into the Washington black-hole, I would have spent it, hired more employees, and generated substantial economic growth. My employees would have enjoyed the wealth of that tax cut in the form of promotions and better salaries. But you can forget it now.When you have a comatose man on the verge of death, you don’t defibrillate and shock his thumb thinking that will bring him back to life, do you?Or, do you defibrillate his heart? Business is at the heart of America and always has been. To restart it, you must stimulate it, not kill it.Suddenly, the power brokers in Washington believe the poor of America are the essential drivers of the American economic engine. Nothing could be further from the truth and this is the type of change you can keep.So where am I going with all this?It’s quite simple.If any new taxes are levied on me, or my company, my reaction will be swift and simple. I fire you. I fire your co-workers. You can then plead with the government to pay for your mortgage, your SUV, and your child’s future.Frankly, it isn’t my problem any more.Then, I will close this company down, move to another country, and retire. You see, I’m done. I’m done with a country that penalizes the productive and gives to the unproductive. My motivation to work and to provide jobs will bedestroyed, and with it, will be my citizenship.So, if you lose your job, it won’t be at the hands of the economy; it will be at the hands of a political hurricane that swept through thiscountry, steamrolled the constitution, and will have changed its landscape forever. If that happens, you can find me sitting on a beach, retired, and with no employees to worry about….Signed,Your boss[/quote']JCM, I don't know who wrote that, but that was great! :clap::clap:Thank you for posting it!

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Fact Check: Members of Congress and Health Care Reformhttp://www.startribune.com/blogs/89041877.html?elr=KArks7PYDiaK7DUHPYDiaK7DUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUU

Interesting thread.You see, THIS is why (unlike the "other" site), we all have remained civil in getting our points across. It's more like a friendly debate. Everyone get's a say.Let's ALL keep it that way. :thumbsup:I'm proud of EVERYONE! :cheers:We are friends here, in MIAMI VICE we trust!! :thumbsup:

[Gary1911A1]

It scares me Obama will do more and not less between now and November. Since so many Democrats are going to be losing their position Obama and his marxist friends will convince congressional democrats though various bribes to just go ahead and vote for cap and trade, immigration reform, and other progressive programs we can't afford.

[Ferrariman]

Coop, I guess I'm out of the loop here. What exactly is going to happen in November?

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Coop' date=' I guess I'm out of the loop here. What exactly is going to happen in November?[/quote']It's the Novermber elections.People are vowing to upseat, and replace all the Democrats that voted on the health care bill by going to the polls, and having thier voice heard. Anger brings people to the polls more than anything. (Look what happened to 40 years of Democratic rule in Mass. with Ted Kennedy)If the conservatives do win a majority of the seats, they plan to repeal the Health Care bill (They'd have to have a VAST majority to overide any Veto the President would surely sign). A small majority can't override it, but put in place, if a new conservative president is elected, they will overturn the bill and then try to put in place a much more sane plan that would do things like Stop frivolous lawsuits on doctors up to a certain amount, stop free health care for Illegal alliens, and have an affordable plan for those who really need it, stop people from forcing to buy Government Health care, no prison for non payers, and try to find a smart way to overhawl the system without creating an expensive, monster Government expansion. Tax credits for low income families is another idea.Conservatives believe in helping people by giving people a break in taxes, not overwhelming them with more taxes, and penalties. Conservatives believe in trying to let people keep as much money as possible, and have the freedom to make thier own choices. Personal responsability.This country has always been, and is a Center / Right nation.Most Democrats still believe in thier beliefs, ...but are not too thrilled with this radical form of Liberalism. Joe Liberman is a good example. He strongly believes in a Democratic point of view, but doesn't agree with where is party is going.JFK was a president who in today's world would be considered a very moderate Democrat. JFK would not approve of what is going on with this new form of Socialistic Liberalism. That's not what he stood for. He was a strong President. The Republicans offered ideas, which for the most part were rejected by the House controlled Democrats. No republicans voted for Obama's bill. Neither did 30 + democrats.When told that the Conservatives plan to repeal the health care bill, today, Obama arrogantly said, ..."GO FOR IT".I believe 13 states have filed lawsuits against the Goverment claiming Forcing people to buy Government health care or go to prison is unconstitutional. One state is filing on it's own, bringing the total number of state lawsuits to 14 at this point, not including private lawsuits.

[maynard]

I wonder what kind of doctors we will have with Barrycare?

[jcm8002204]

Fact Check: Members of Congress and Health Care Reformhttp://www.startribune.com/blogs/89041877.html?elr=KArks7PYDiaK7DUHPYDiaK7DUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUU

Yes...I read that...and this excerpt from it:...No' date=' not really. All government employees, including members of Congress, [b']can opt into the Federal Employee Health Benefits Program, which Bachmann has. But nothing about the federal plan will change, except that it will be purchased through an exchange......Note they have the option of "OPT IN"....we don't, and we cannot OPT OUT.. unless we pay a fine.......the devil is in the details....

[Tony D.]

Interesting thread.You see' date=' THIS is why (unlike the "other" site), we all have remained civil in getting our points across. It's more like a friendly debate. Everyone get's a say.Let's ALL keep it that way. :thumbsup:I'm proud of EVERYONE! :cheers:We are friends here, in MIAMI VICE we trust!! :thumbsup:[/quote'] The "other site" had friendly debates......only a few bad apples made it unfriendly.

[COOPER&BURNETT]

The "other site" had friendly debates......only a few bad apples made it unfriendly.

That's why those bad apples aren't allowed here, ...but they are allowed there.

[Tony D.]

Their posts have been few & far between & the few were acceptable.

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Because there is nothing left there anymore, and nobody left to bully.

[Frey]

Obamacare week one review:http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704100604575146002445136066.htmlAnd this is just the beginning. :cry:

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Obamacare week one review:http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704100604575146002445136066.htmlAnd this is just the beginning. :cry:

OMG!!! Read a quote from the article!"Yesterday AT&T announced that it will be forced to make a $1 billion writedown due solely to the health bill, in what has become a wave of such corporate losses.This wholesale destruction of wealth and capital came with more than ample warning."Oh....my.....gawd.STOP THIS MADDNESS. Businesses can't loose a Billion dollars a year and remain comptitive without making changes...(like mass layoffs for example) Thinking this is a good idea, or will work is a fantasy.