Episode 38, Florence Italy

[C Glide]

I have just posted this episode on my location web site. Check it outhttp://www.sffl.comcastbiz.net[

[Matt5]

Teaser - screaching at red light - lamborgini appears Biscayne / Ne 5th & 6th St - Downtown.[ATTACH=CONFIG]7731[/ATTACH]

[Pink Flaming0]

Great photo !

[C Glide]

:thumbsup:

[airtommy]

The scene where C&T pull up to the corner where the Fat Boys are hanging out:

I am assuming this is in downtown Miami due to the street-level retail store and because the other scenes from this ep were filmed there.

Notice that the curb is cut only once, on the corner, rather than a separate curb cut for each direction.  From left to right we have

1.  the corner curb cut

2.  sewer drain

3.  pole for traffic signal or street sign

4.  tree

Also, the street in the background is one-way, going away from the camera.

Also, there is no fire hydrant.

The only corner in downtown that fits these 6 criteria is the SE corner of NW 2 AV & NE 2 ST:

Google Street View link

Notice in the background you can see arched windows just like in the screen capture above.  The rest of the background building(s) doesn't quite match up and I can't really explain why.

Edited July 15, 2018 by airtommy

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Looks like things have changed over time.

 

Nice work airtommy!

[airtommy]

The scene where Danny takes off in the motorcycle:
 

 
This is not northbound on NE 2 AV with reversed film.  There is indeed a McDonald's at the corner of NE 2 AV & NE 4 ST, but it wasn't there when they filmed this ep.  Back then the McDonald's was at the corner of NE 2 AV and NE 3 ST.  In this aerial from 1986, I have marked the motorcycle and the McDonald's.  You can see the distinctive roof:
 

 
Looking at the screen capture above, there is a building behind the McDonald's.  You can see that this building is still there today, the pattern of windows matches:
 

 
Here is a Google Street View link if you want to scan around the area:  click me

Edited July 15, 2018 by airtommy

[miamijimf]

Here are all the old .org posts about this episode.  A member has requested some of the background info that led to the finding of the locations.

 

 posted by airtommy 9 Oct 2006 

At the end of the episode, they chase Frank Tepper through the streets of Miami and he ends the chase by running into a wall. The chase starts on Biscayne Blvd near where Bayside Marketplace is now. I'm not sure exactly where he turns onto Biscayne. Then it proceeeds here:


    
Finally, they skip to NW Miami Ct. I circled the corner facade of the building that he crashes into:

At the top left corner of the picture, you can see the baseball diamond whose light towers are visible behind Tepper as he races down NW Miami Ct.

 

 

posted by airtommy 9 Oct 2006

 

I'm guessing the bakery was on E. Flagler between 2nd and 3rd Ave?
 

posted by MATT5 9 Oct 2006

 

Yup thats it - right by the Santa Fe Centre on E Flagler.

Santa Fe Centre is pretty much unchanged today and is seen when C & T drive down E Flagler in b/g.

The bakery is now 2/3 stores one of which is a discount perfume shop - but very recognisable and mainly unchanged.

 

posted by airtommy 9 Oct 2006

 

What is the Santa Fe Centre called today? I found nothing under that name in Google and in directories. The only way I could guess at the location was by the Walgreens across the street.

 

posted by MATT5 9 Oct 2006

 

airtommy - Santa Fe Centre is still called that today. Its like a mini arcade with a few stores exactly the same as 1985.

I had the same problem couldnt find anything under google.

I did a SoflaJeremy and stumbled on it .

 

 

posted by airtommy 31 Dec 2006

 

How 'bout that driving scene at the beginning? Definitely downtown. Hmmm ....   

 

 

posted by airtommy 3 Jan 2007

 

Naughty Naughty - The first thing you see is the Gayety Burlesque sign. Shortly after that, you see the sign for Wolfie's 21. Both of those Miami Beach Collins Ave landmarks are closed, as DanJ has documented. The rest of the opening montage is filmed around the Santa Fe Center at 223 E. Flagler in downtown Miami.

C&T make one of The Fat Boys swallow his joint - I don't see a yellow & blue awning anywhere on satellite. Obviously, it could very well have changed. My best guess is the intersection of E. Flagler and NE 3rd Ave. NE 3rd Ave is one-way northbound. In the episode, the road has cars parked in the same direction on both sides.

Then, the action shifts to Biscayne. They go by a "Use Coppertone" sign a bunch of times.

7:12-7:17 - They are driving south on Biscayne Blvd and turn right onto SE 2nd St. First, the Metromover station is in the background. Later, the famous Bank of America tower is plainly visible. Part of this camera shot is recycled at 7:30.

Crockett spins out 7:38 - I believe they are going west on Flagler and turn left onto SE 1st Ave. A sign indicates they are now going the wrong way down a one-way street. At 7:42, there's a street sign in the top left of the screen. Does this read "SE 1 Ave"? Does the sign at 7:38 read "E Flagler St"? Note that this intersection has peculiar indented sidewalks on the corners. This matches up on satellite.

 

Body Drop 7:57 - They are at the intersection of SE 1st St and SE 1st Ave. Looming large in the background is the rarely seen BACKSIDE of the famous Bank of America Tower. On the right of the screen is the Metromover

 

posted by DanJ 28 Mar 07

 

 

Tubbs: How much?
Fat Boy: Your price.
Tubbs (Flashing his badge): Make it disappear!

Hah! What a great scene! Looks they all had a hoot filming that one (Wonder if there are outtakes of this for a Vice Blooper Reel?)!

Now, to continue our exploration of this episode, here are some pic's that Richie Rich took through the dirty windshield of my car when we visited one of the two parking garages where the bike race was filmed:

 

Originally posted by Richie Rich

Ready for the 2007 version of the "Florence, Italy" parking garage motorcycle race? This is what that same parking garage looks like now - 2007.

Driver - DanJ.

Produced and Directed by -  DanJ.

Photographer - Richie Rich.

Ready. Set Go!

 

 

 

 

Exit the ramp - and head for the 13th Level. Move it!

 

 

Lean into that last turn and...           you made it!

 

 

You earned the checkered flag!

 

 

Stay tuned for a Google map of downtown, showing the location of the parking garages...

 

 

posted by DanJ 28 March 2007

 

Here we go - this is where the bike race took place:

(click for larger image)

 

X: Bike Race Starts
X: Actual Bike Race
X: Bike Race Ends (Bikes exit parking garage, dump out onto NE 3rd Street in front of Miami-Dade Community College)
X: McDonald's (Danny Tepper speeds down street on bike)
Orange Arrow: Direction of DT as he speeds down street on bike

 

Posted by soflajeremy: 28 March 2007 

Your arrow is in the wrong direction.  the film was reversed.  In the show he is traveling north the wrong direction agaist the lights so all you see is the back side of the traffic lights.  you also see the metrorail overpass in the bg to the north.

 

 

 

posted by airtommy 28 March 2007 

 

Also, there are two red X's instead of one red and one orange.

Masp - I thought the Coppertone sign in the ep was on Biscayne, but I'll have to check it again. Does Masp = MATT5?

P.S. I replaced my pics with clickable thumbs.

 

Postedby MATT5: 28 March 2007 

Sorry yeah Masp is my old user name - I was looking through Mv.org old posts today dating back to 2003/2004 and saw my old username masp which I used from Dec 2003 for approx 1 year but then joined again in May 2006 under Matt5 as I couldnt remember my old password from before !- but I spent 5 minutes today and found it! and I was just referencing my old posts from 3 years ago.

You are right about the Coppertone it was on Biscayne ( too built up opp. Courthouse )
 

soflajeremy posted: 28 March 2007

Yup,  there was a gulf station and a goodyear tire center there on us 1 that were seen in many a nightime driving sequence but are long gone along with the neighboring coppertone sign.

DanJ posted: 29 March 2007

DEPARTMENT OF CORRECTIONS:

The red X just below the green X indicates the start of the bike race. The other red X by itself down below is the site of the actual bike race.

Sorry for the error, gang.

Originally posted by SOFLAJEREMY

Your arrow is in the wrong direction. The film was reversed. In the show he is traveling north the wrong direction against the lights so all you see is the back side of the traffic lights. You also see the metrorail overpass in the bg to the north.
 

This warrants discussion.

Let's look at the image as it appears in the episode, and for the moment assume it is not reversed:
 

There is a car parked along the east-westbound street in front of the McDonald's, clearly indicating the street and the corner. This places the McDonald's at the southeast corner of the intersection, which is where it sits today, and has us looking southbound (As well as Danny Tepper heading southbound on his bike.). Look at the sign - it is a bit blurry, but to my eye it does not look backward, which it would be if the image were reversed.

Now reverse the image. I see what looks like the Metrorail overpass, but this is what I don't get: If we are now looking northbound and DT is heading north, that puts the McDonald's on the northeast corner - furthermore, the McDonald's sign now looks backward to me. Putting the issue of the sign aside, the change of the restaurant's location is what really throws me for a loop. Assuming Jeremy is correct about the image reversal, the only conclusion I can draw is that the restaurant has been moved since then. Might that be possible, or am I missing something here?

 

soflajeremy posted: 29 March 2007

 

While it does look like the license plate still reads left to right vip4evr the signal lights are facing the other direction so maybe they could have changed the direction of travel on this street since the time of vice but I doubt they re routed the metro rail  dug up the fire hydrants ( which I have learned to use in my mv investigations because they are so constant) and moved them to the oposite side of the street.  Also check out the buildings in the bg

 

 

soflajeremy posted on 30 Mar 07

 

could we both be wrong and he be headed east on what is now a campus walkway. not 100% lined up  for either case I am confused by this one.

 

soflajeremy posted: 30 March 2007 

Here is a recap of the interior part of the race located at 2oo South Biscayne Blv. They race down the 13th floor, then the 12th, then error they are back on the 13th floor  13^TH again, then the 11th floor followed by the 10th and then the 10th floor again then back on the 13th floor, followed by the 9th floor, then in order 7th, 6th, 5th 4th floors, but then 7th again and 5th again 4th again then down the wrong way out the entrance spiral.  Seems like the way to win the race would have been to go straight down w/o repeating floors

 

 

DanJ posted: 30 March 2007 

Now I feel compelled to go out to downtown Miami one of these nights with screen captures in hand - both reversed and non-reversed - to check this out in more detail - anybody wanna come with?

Geez how many times did they hit the 13th floor? Just goes ta show ya that any Vicers who visit that garage, the 13th level is the level to visit!

 

soflajeremy posted: 30 March 2007 

I think mickey d's may have moved as they sometimes do because I notice the difference in distance between the metro rail then (close) and now (further) which would be explained if it had been located on the ne corner as opposed to it's current location.

 

DanJ posted: 30 March 2007 

I concur, detective. All that's left is verification of Mickey D's having changed locations. Maybe we can give this to Trudy, so she can look it up on the computer?

In the meantime, study this postcard carefully. Check the middle to upper left hand edge for potential clues as to the location of Mickey D's. It may or may not shed light on the issue - and while you're at it note how many other things have changed around the downtown MDCC campus since this aerial was taken...

 

airtommy posted: 31 March 2007

 

 

This metrorail is straight. The one over NE 2nd Ave is curved. So we can definitely rule out NE 2nd Ave.

Dan, the building you marked as McDonald's looks like no McDonald's I've ever seen. More importantly, it is an impossible location for the official address: 345 NE 2nd Ave.

 

 

So, we're looking for:

1. straight metrorail bridge
2. wrong way down a one-way road
3. McDonald's on the left

I'd say he's going eastbound on NE 3rd Street.

Yellow X = McDonald's
Red X = building behind McDonald's

 

 

One problem: the building that looks most like McDonald's on sat pics is actually at the corner of NE 4th St and NE 2nd Ave (two buildings north of my yellow X).

When you guys visit this location, the key is identifying the "Red X" building.

 

soflajeremy posted: 31 March 2007 

OK I did not really look closely at dans picture assuming the x's were correct but the x for mickey d's is misplaced.  I know I have done that myself even when knowing the correct location I blame it on being tired when it happens with me.  It should be 1 block to the north.  The north corner of the same block where you put your x airtommy.  Now if it had been where your x is placed that would have made sense.  It has a tower at it's n east end and is the second building north of airtommy's x.  I took alot of pics when I was there as I have become accustomed to do because no matter what I always miss something if I don't take pictures of the surrounding area. I will check the pictures when I get home to see what I can come up with regarding the bg buildings

 

soflajeremy  posted: 31 March 2007 

btw in the teaser between the collins ave shot and the east flaggler shots they are at two other locations  one looks like nyc the other like washington ave,.  anyone know?

airtommy posted: 31 March 2007 at 7:23pm

    
That's where I thought the McDonald's is. It looks quite obvious on satellite (red roof with stripes), but the location is wrong for us.

So McDonald's is a red herring and the key to this mystery is the "Red X" building.
 

airtommy posted 31 Mar 07

 

Looking at Dan's postcard:


That doesn't look like McDonald's on the north end of that block where it currently sits. Certainly, the rest of that block has changed a lot.
 

 

 

airtommy posted: 01 April 2007 

Originally posted by SOFLAJEREMY

btw in the teaser between the collins ave shot and the east flaggler shots they are at two other locations  one looks like nyc the other like washington ave,.  anyone know?

It's hard for me to know which shots you are talking about because there are a bunch. Two that I have no clue on:

The Concord Electronics shot gets recycled in Season 3, I just saw it but forgot where. I assumed this was on Flagler without thinking about it. I just noticed the vehicles in the scene look like they're from the 1970s. Maybe this is old stock footage?

Right after that we see a shot with a billboard with a "Golden Lights" cigarette ad.

 

soflajeremy posted: 02 April 2007

those are the shots.  The second looks like ny city and the first is not Flagler because the road curves in the near bg. and the side walk is concrete as opposed to pavers in the concrete.  I think on sobe but will have to investigate. 

 

soflajeremy posted: 09 April 2007

danj and I had a great day of location sleuthing today and solved several mysteries.  One is the mcdonalds mystery,  The restaurant if you can call it that did in fact move,  Where it is now on the nw corner of the block at the time of mv it was on the sw corner of the block.  This makes alot more sense to me because he just drives up the street from the garage, where as the other way they had to set up the cameras on the next street over.  much more work it would seem.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 17, 2015 by miamijimf

[airtommy]

Yeah, I thought I remembered that discussion.  Thanks for saving and posting that!

[airtommy]

In C Glide's location guide, he says "Then he crashes into a well disguised open garage door and the episode ends."
 
http://www.miamivicelocations2.org/page27.html
 
He approaches the wall:
 

 
Here is the wall in real life today:
 

 
So I watched the end frame by frame and noticed this:
 

 
You can actually see the fake wall breaking.     I'm impressed that they went to such lengths and actually had a stunt driver run into the fake wall.

Edited July 15, 2018 by airtommy

[C Glide]

You have inspired me to take another look. I believe you are right about the Mcdonald's scene and have updated my site. Thanks.  That gave me the opportunity to add a photo I took about a year ago of the conference room at the Mayfair where they held the driver's party. I also found the three driving scene locations that had previously eluded me and updated those in my site. Happy happy.

 

RE: the corner scene I do not believe that was at second and second. Too much does not line up with the buildings and though sometimes fire hydrants are moved or removed it is rare so that is also an issue. I have another location in mind. Looking for old pictures to confirm since both buildings have been replaced. Biscayne and NE2nd.

Hydrant in right location. 

 

Sign reflected in Daytona will help confirm, just need to find old picture of hotel.

[C Glide]

We see this intersection in the background later in the ep. Looks like a good possibility.

 

[C Glide]

1986 sat. looks like no building at 2nd and 2nd.

[James]

This is the Miami Grand Prix in 1985, when and where Florence Italy was filmed.

 

Featuring 1985 TV ads.

Track map of the circuit located in Bayfront Park. The main straight, turns 1 and 2, and the straight opposite that is on Biscayne.

[airtommy]

Shortly before the race starts, Trudy is in front of the Ritz Hotel on 134 Flagler Street in downtown Miami showing photos to people.  Here is a nice historic view of the building:

 

http://historymiamiarchives.org/guides/?p=digitallibrary/digitalcontent&id=17

[airtommy]

Whoa! C Glide has added a new find to his "Florence Italy" page.  In the final chase, we see this clip at 47:53:

 

 

 

I was hunting for this for a long time.  I kept searching around 12th St, but it turns out they are far away:

 

"Then we see Crockett and Tubbs chasing, southbound on Biscayne Blvd., Passing #2650."

 

http://www.miamivicelocations2.org/page27.html

 

 

 

[Matt5]

Whoa! C Glide has added a new find to his "Florence Italy" page.  In the final chase, we see this clip at 47:53:

 

 

 

I was hunting for this for a long time.  I kept searching around 12th St, but it turns out they are far away:

 

"Then we see Crockett and Tubbs chasing, southbound on Biscayne Blvd., Passing #2650."

 

http://www.miamivicelocations2.org/page27.html

 

 

 

 

 

Nice work - and a location we have not seen in Vice before !!    

[C Glide]

I think that is one of the driving scenes I referred to in post #11.

[Matt5]

I hope to see that location 

[airtommy]

I think that is one of the driving scenes I referred to in post #11.

 

Wow, I totally missed that.   Also, C Glide added a photo of the Mayfair conference room which I missed

[airtommy]

There is one more unidentified clip.  In the 43rd minute C&T drive to the race to arrest Tepper. Right after they drive north on Biscayne Blvd past 26th Terrace, we see this clip:
 

 

 
I can't locate this.  There is a street sign above their heads, but it's too blurry for me to read.  The street is lined with palms and two lanes each way, so it should be Biscayne like the other clips in this sequence. On the right side of the screen, there is a house with a red tile roof, then a lot with heavy shrubbery, then a street, then a small building that looks like a business, and possibly a bus stop.

Edited July 15, 2018 by airtommy

[Matt5]

There is one more unidentified clip.  In the 43rd minute C&T drive to the race to arrest Tepper. Right after they drive north on Biscayne Blvd past 26th Terrace, we see this clip:

 

 

 

I can't locate this.  There is a street sign above their heads, but it's too blurry for me to read.  The street is lined with palms and two lanes each way, so it should be Biscayne like the other clips in this sequence. On the right side of the screen, there is a house with a red tile roof, then a lot with heavy shrubbery, then a street, then a small building that looks like a business, and possibly a bus stop.

 

 

 

With all those clues - must be able to locate !!

[Matt5]

The Coppertone sign seen in the teaser in this episode at Biscayne and 5th as we look south down Biscayne Bvld in Downtown 

Edited March 20, 2017 by Matt5

[Matt5]

Another of the famous Coppertone sign we see in the teaser of this Season 2 episode as C&T get in the chasing spirit. After all the ‘Miami Grand Prix  is a little like Christmas, Tubbs once a year’!

 A 1991 picture sent to me today of the sign which stood at NE6th St and Biscayne Bvld.

Edited January 19, 2019 by Matt5

[Matt5]

And this was sent to me today to compliment the last photo - again we see this area exactly in the teaser of this 1986 episode. (This photo dates 1960s).