Dadrian Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 Has it ever been discussed whether or not the lady in the final house (Brenda’s house) is the same lady from the first house in Home Invaders (Kay Ingram). If not, it REALLY looks and sounds like her (with a different haircut). If so, talk about a typecast! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bren10 Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 10 hours ago, Dadrian said: Has it ever been discussed whether or not the lady in the final house (Brenda’s house) is the same lady from the first house in Home Invaders (Kay Ingram). If not, it REALLY looks and sounds like her (with a different haircut). If so, talk about a typecast! According to IMDB and Miami Vice wiki Kay Ingram only appeared once in Home Invaders. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedDragon86 Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 What would have made this episode even better is if the prowler actually killed to begin with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 I disagree. Part of what makes this episode interesting is the escalation of threat. Crockett sees it, as does his old mentor. We sort of see it, but no one else does. It's that growing urgency, seen at first by a few and then expanding, that builds part of the tension. If we already knew he was a killer, resource allocation would have been different because the cops would have been chasing an actual killer and not just a freak who breaks into houses and tosses flour around. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedDragon86 Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) 55 minutes ago, Robbie C. said: I disagree. Part of what makes this episode interesting is the escalation of threat. Crockett sees it, as does his old mentor. We sort of see it, but no one else does. It's that growing urgency, seen at first by a few and then expanding, that builds part of the tension. If we already knew he was a killer, resource allocation would have been different because the cops would have been chasing an actual killer and not just a freak who breaks into houses and tosses flour around. The thing is though how do you profile a guy who hasn't killed? all they had to go by is that he steals mens pants, puts flour on his face and eats raw meat. Surely what would build tension is that he is going to kill again, and like Manhunter they know when but don't now where. Edited January 31, 2019 by RedDragon86 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 But a significant part of this episode is Crockett's growing conviction that the guy WILL kill. If you start that way, you lose that tension and it turns into something else. "Criminal Minds" is based on that "he will kill again" tension and it's nowhere near as interesting in my view. And you'd also lose the connection between Crockett and his mentor, as if a murder's involved it would go directly to Homicide. Obviously you can profile someone who hasn't killed yet. They do it during the episode. Gradual escalation on the part of the intruder. It's not necessarily an obvious pattern, but Crockett sees it and we're willing others to see it, too, because he does. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dadrian Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) 13 hours ago, Dadrian said: Has it ever been discussed whether or not the lady in the final house (Brenda’s house) is the same lady from the first house in Home Invaders (Kay Ingram). If not, it REALLY looks and sounds like her (with a different haircut). If so, talk about a typecast! 2 hours ago, Bren10 said: According to IMDB and Miami Vice wiki Kay Ingram only appeared once in Home Invaders. Thanks, Bren10. I saw that, but that resource has been proven wrong before. There are many uncredited roles throughout the show, hence, my question above. I feel almost sure it’s her, but I’ve been wrong many times. Edited January 31, 2019 by Dadrian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedDragon86 Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 2 hours ago, Robbie C. said: But a significant part of this episode is Crockett's growing conviction that the guy WILL kill. If you start that way, you lose that tension and it turns into something else. "Criminal Minds" is based on that "he will kill again" tension and it's nowhere near as interesting in my view. And you'd also lose the connection between Crockett and his mentor, as if a murder's involved it would go directly to Homicide. Obviously you can profile someone who hasn't killed yet. They do it during the episode. Gradual escalation on the part of the intruder. It's not necessarily an obvious pattern, but Crockett sees it and we're willing others to see it, too, because he does. You have convince me that I am looking at it the wrong way 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 I've just suffered through enough episodes of "Criminal Minds" of late to find the "when will he kill again" angle very trite, honestly. What I loved about "Shadow in the Dark" is that you weren't really sure if he would or not. You always wondered if Crockett was reading it wrong because his mentor did, or if the crazy guy with the flour was about to kill. You always knew the guy was disturbed, but it was the uncertainty about the level of his psychosis that made the whole thing work for me. Did he just mess with Crockett's head or is Sonny onto something? That was great, and kind of out of the box for Vice. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bren10 Posted February 2, 2019 Report Share Posted February 2, 2019 It's amazing how much suspense was built without any killing. One of the truly great episodes imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dadrian Posted February 2, 2019 Report Share Posted February 2, 2019 37 minutes ago, Bren10 said: Dadrian, I just watched both eps back to back. I think you called it right. Good eye. She was only there for a few seconds in Shadow but I noticed her long features and the voice is the same, I think. Here’s another believer. Anyone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
summer84 Posted February 3, 2019 Report Share Posted February 3, 2019 27 minutes ago, Dadrian said: Here’s another believer. Anyone else? I'll have to check. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
summer84 Posted February 3, 2019 Report Share Posted February 3, 2019 I did a side by side pic comparison. Even though I'm not sure, (like I was with the recent Garcelle Beauvais actress discovery in "The Great McCarthy") I see a similarity in her face, when looking at the eyes. I can't rule it out entirely. It could possibly be the same actress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dadrian Posted February 4, 2019 Report Share Posted February 4, 2019 4 hours ago, summer84 said: I did a side by side pic comparison. Even though I'm not sure, (like I was with the recent Garcelle Beauvais actress discovery in "The Great McCarthy") I see a similarity in her face, when looking at the eyes. I can't rule it out entirely. It could possibly be the same actress. Thanks the pics! Looks pretty convincing to me. Also, the voice is the same. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted February 4, 2019 Report Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 1/31/2019 at 10:10 AM, Robbie C. said: But a significant part of this episode is Crockett's growing conviction that the guy WILL kill. If you start that way, you lose that tension and it turns into something else. "Criminal Minds" is based on that "he will kill again" tension and it's nowhere near as interesting in my view. And you'd also lose the connection between Crockett and his mentor, as if a murder's involved it would go directly to Homicide. Obviously you can profile someone who hasn't killed yet. They do it during the episode. Gradual escalation on the part of the intruder. It's not necessarily an obvious pattern, but Crockett sees it and we're willing others to see it, too, because he does. Very well put! P.S. I do like Criminal Minds, too though. But, this idea makes for another captivating if not bizarre episode. As has been stated many times before too, is that what makes it even more freaky and fascinating is it’s based on a real-life case! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedDragon86 Posted August 12, 2019 Report Share Posted August 12, 2019 (edited) On 2/3/2019 at 10:45 PM, summer84 said: I did a side by side pic comparison. Even though I'm not sure, (like I was with the recent Garcelle Beauvais actress discovery in "The Great McCarthy") I see a similarity in her face, when looking at the eyes. I can't rule it out entirely. It could possibly be the same actress. She definitely made an appearance in "Glades" as the courtroom typist. Edited August 12, 2019 by RedDragon86 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dadrian Posted August 12, 2019 Report Share Posted August 12, 2019 10 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said: She definitely made an appearance in "Glades" as the courtroom typist. “Sheer poetry in motion” 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjcmmv Posted August 12, 2019 Report Share Posted August 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Dadrian said: “Sheer poetry in motion” I think she "shot poor Rico down" in that scene! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detective_Crockett Posted August 18, 2019 Report Share Posted August 18, 2019 (edited) One of my all time favourites. Every episode of Season 3 from Stone's War and forward at the moment has been truly solid. I go crazy myself trying to understand the Shadow's motives. I love anything to do with psychological and mental horror. I still need to get around to watching Mann's Manhunter as I've heard this one is clearly inspired by it. Gilmore was a nut, glad Crockett didn't go fully crazy like him. Superb acting by DJ in this episode. Also, The Shadow looks like Jan Hammer Edited August 18, 2019 by Detective_Crockett 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjcmmv Posted August 18, 2019 Report Share Posted August 18, 2019 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Detective_Crockett said: I go crazy myself trying to understand the Shadow's motives. I love anything to do with psychological and mental horror. I still need to get around to watching Mann's Manhunter as I've heard this one is clearly inspired by it. Gilmore was a nut, glad Crockett didn't go fully crazy like him. Superb acting by DJ in this episode. Lots of good points here. Michael Mann's "Manhunter" is a classic and I see lots of similarities to the danger in this episode. Edited August 18, 2019 by mjcmmv 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted August 18, 2019 Report Share Posted August 18, 2019 I think the Shadow in some ways is like the kids in Nobody Lives Forever. Maybe he doesn't HAVE a motive as we understand motives. NLF was all about the randomness of violence sometimes, and maybe the Shadow is more about the night terror that lurks in so many people. Maybe this guy finally snapped. Or maybe there isn't supposed to be a motive and the real drama is watching the whole thing break one good cop and almost break another. Trying to find motive where there is no motive. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted August 18, 2019 Report Share Posted August 18, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Detective_Crockett said: One of my all time favourites. Every episode of Season 3 from Stone's War and forward at the moment has been truly solid. I go crazy myself trying to understand the Shadow's motives. I love anything to do with psychological and mental horror. I still need to get around to watching Mann's Manhunter as I've heard this one is clearly inspired by it. Gilmore was a nut, glad Crockett didn't go fully crazy like him. Superb acting by DJ in this episode. Also, The Shadow looks like Jan Hammer One of my all-time favorite episodes too! It’s also based on a true story, which makes it even freakier! As for motives for “Shadow Man” (I’ve always jokingly called him “Fish Mouth” )...I actually think there was one, but only in his scrambled up, psychotic mind—not one we’d necessarily understand. The raw meat & flour ritual obviously meant something to him or served some bizarre purpose for him, as he kept doing it in each house...it wasn’t a random one-time thing. Also there was something about each house that drew him to it...that “spoke” to him somehow. With each house he kept moving closer to the bedroom of the owner, too...but until the very last one, he left before actually attacking or killing. I think his objective was to ultimately kill...but the house, situation, environment, etc...had to be perfect, or he bailed before actually carrying out the kill. It’s almost as if he was trying to carry out some kind of “sacrificial” or ritualistic kill for some whacked-out purpose we weren’t totally privy to. Edited August 18, 2019 by ViceFanMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt5 Posted August 18, 2019 Report Share Posted August 18, 2019 A very well done episode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detective_Crockett Posted August 18, 2019 Report Share Posted August 18, 2019 Also, here's a question... In the cafe scene with Castillo, was Crockett drinking whiskey or Espresso? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt5 Posted August 18, 2019 Report Share Posted August 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Detective_Crockett said: Also, here's a question... In the cafe scene with Castillo, was Crockett drinking whiskey or Espresso? Expresso - early morning / dawn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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