Sea-light Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 The only one thing-where wtf is Rico's child and what for they made this ep, if they didn't explain the story of a baby in anyway?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, Sea-light said: The only one thing-where wtf is Rico's child and what for they made this ep, if they didn't explain the story of a baby in anyway?! The main reason that things were not ever fully explained or resolved is new writers at the time. They basically “abandoned” previous storylines, and whatever happened to Tubbs’ baby is never stated. In this episode he thinks his son is dead, and he never finds out otherwise. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Vigilante Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 Definitely a missed opportunity of an episode! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea-light Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 22 hours ago, ViceFanMan said: The main reason that things were not ever fully explained or resolved is new writers at the time. They basically “abandoned” previous storylines, and whatever happened to Tubbs’ baby is never stated. In this episode he thinks his son is dead, and he never finds out otherwise. Yes. This is the thing I'll never forgive the writers 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 51 minutes ago, Sea-light said: Yes. This is the thing I'll never forgive the writers Try the producers. For all we know a writer proposed this and was shot down. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
summer84 Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 (edited) I agree about it being the producers/Dick Wolf who was in charge. And probably Michael Mann as well. Another example would be "Mothers Keeper" written about Sonny and Gina undercover as a married couple, trying to develop that relationships, but it wasn't picked for some reason... Coop shared the script in one of the threads. And I believe it was Michael Manns decision not to bring back Sonny's kid until the later seasons. Etc. The show took a new direction in S3. Maybe this wasn't what Dick Wolf personally wanted to focus on, he had a different goal with the storylines. Edited June 8, 2020 by summer84 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea-light Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 36 minutes ago, summer84 said: I agree about it being the producers/Dick Wolf who was in charge. And probably Michael Mann as well. Another example would be "Mothers Keeper" written about Sonny and Gina undercover as a married couple, trying to develop that relationships, but it wasn't picked for some reason... Coop shared the script in one of the threads. And I believe it was Michael Manns decision not to bring back Sonny's kid until the later seasons. Etc. The show took a new direction in S3. Maybe this wasn't what Dick Wolf personally wanted to focus on, he had a different goal with the storylines. Tubb's kid? I agree about desision not to focus on a baby, ok. But it should have been smth to finish this line. Because fans are not fools and they showed the fans that the baby was stolen, not killed. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 Storylines were unfortunately secondary throughout much of Vice’s run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 5 hours ago, Sea-light said: Yes. This is the thing I'll never forgive the writers 3 hours ago, Sea-light said: Tubb's kid? I agree about desision not to focus on a baby, ok. But it should have been smth to finish this line. Because fans are not fools and they showed the fans that the baby was stolen, not killed. Yeah, the new writers basically abandoned and did away with previous plot lines or character storylines, and subsequently a couple were left open-ended and/or never concluded. They should have concluded the Tubbs’ baby one...given it closure. It didn’t need to be always front and center, but just an episode to show that Tubbs did learn his son was alive. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea-light Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 4 hours ago, ViceFanMan said: Yeah, the new writers basically abandoned and did away with previous plot lines or character storylines, and subsequently a couple were left open-ended and/or never concluded. They should have concluded the Tubbs’ baby one...given it closure. It didn’t need to be always front and center, but just an episode to show that Tubbs did learn his son was alive. The island, Tubbs's old NY friend, who worked on Calderone-when I watched the first time, I was sure, she was a nurse of his child. So easy was to find his kid there-only one talk:) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt5 Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 7 hours ago, Sea-light said: The island, Tubbs's old NY friend, who worked on Calderone-when I watched the first time, I was sure, she was a nurse of his child. So easy was to find his kid there-only one talk:) Ha ha good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedDragon86 Posted June 10, 2020 Report Share Posted June 10, 2020 (edited) On 6/9/2020 at 6:44 AM, Sea-light said: The island, Tubbs's old NY friend, who worked on Calderone-when I watched the first time, I was sure, she was a nurse of his child. So easy was to find his kid there-only one talk:) Did Sally Cordova connect with Orlando anyway, I think once Esteban was killed she was no longer involved with The Calderone's in a personal way. I could be wrong but I don't she knew about the baby. Edited June 10, 2020 by RedDragon86 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea-light Posted June 10, 2020 Report Share Posted June 10, 2020 4 hours ago, RedDragon86 said: Did Sally Cordova connect with Orlando anyway, I think once Esteban was killed she was no longer involved with The Calderone's in a personal way. I could be wrong but I don't she knew about the baby. Esteban was the father, and Sally worked on Orlando, the son. Sure, she didn't knew whose baby, but the good way could be to show her as a nurse. No matter, whose baby, just a babysitter. My dreams:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebax Posted December 28, 2020 Report Share Posted December 28, 2020 Well, this one was better than Theresa in my opinion. I'll give it a 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedDragon86 Posted December 28, 2020 Report Share Posted December 28, 2020 Lack of continuity with the storylines was simply down to production changes in 3, there is no doubt that if Nicollela and Mann stayed there would have been a resolution with Tubbs son. Between the seasons 1-2 there is a remembrance of situations with Valerie and Tubbs. Gina's borderline rape ordeal with Ramirez is implied in "Bought and Paid For" Angelina returns, Castillos arc was nice and tidy adding Gretsky to his past with The Golden Triangle, Lombard was always in the background and Barbara Carrow is mentioned in the season 1 finale. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewRemington Posted December 28, 2020 Report Share Posted December 28, 2020 John Leguizamo looks like some 8th grade punk. I think Tubbs could have just took him on his knee and spanked him or sent him to his room without supper. Haha... Not a bad episode, though. I think it’s terrible we don’t really know what happened to Ricardo Jr, but Tubbs being a single dad and a cop would have made it difficult to feature him raising an infant son. I bet there are plenty of single female cops that have kids, though... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie1996 Posted April 23, 2021 Report Share Posted April 23, 2021 On 4/6/2014 at 4:05 PM, BlueAir said: My question is why was there a casket for the baby in "Sons and Lovers"? Been wanting to ask this since I watched it! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie1996 Posted April 23, 2021 Report Share Posted April 23, 2021 On 5/17/2017 at 9:17 PM, Remington said: C and T pick unattractive girlfriends. Especially the ex he encounters at the hotel. I often think that too. You'd think Crockett at least would manage better! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie1996 Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 Watched this last night and found it unimpressive. I don't like episodes that concentrate 100% on Tubbs, to begin with and also this wasn't particularly well done ( as has already been pointed out- for instance it's beyond belief that he wouldn't have broken into the police station and got some guns and hopefully ammo.) In fact I can't see him being rash enough to take off on some "free" holiday anyway unarmed and with no one to watch his back, given the job he was doing, where you must be making numerous enemies consisting of very nasty characters. Unenthralling, though fair enough , not soporific I'll give it a 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Vigilante Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 20 hours ago, wolfie1996 said: Been wanting to ask this since I watched it! Wasn't it because they assumed the baby was still in the car when it exploded? Realistically, they were able to find adult remains, but probably not infant (as morbid as that sounds), so they buried an empty casket. Rico's expression at the end of "Sons and Lovers" made me think the opening of S3 would have going full renegade. Instead, we got this episode. Disappointing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie1996 Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Mr. Vigilante said: Rico's expression at the end of "Sons and Lovers" made me think the opening of S3 would have going full renegade. Instead, we got this episode. Disappointing Couldn't agree more, Mr. V. And I'd add, curiously flat, given what was supposedly such a tense situation (I might add, unlike the original High Noon, which was excellent.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, Mr. Vigilante said: Wasn't it because they assumed the baby was still in the car when it exploded? Realistically, they were able to find adult remains, but probably not infant (as morbid as that sounds), so they buried an empty casket. Rico's expression at the end of "Sons and Lovers" made me think the opening of S3 would have going full renegade. Instead, we got this episode. Disappointing. You’re correct...they showed Tubbs’ baby son being secretly taken from Angelina by Orlando Jr & “back to the house with Maria” I believe?? They put a fake roll of blankets in the car with Angelina so Tubbs would see it & think his son was killed too. The casket at the funeral was a symbol of memoriam. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicegirl85 Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 56 minutes ago, Mr. Vigilante said: Wasn't it because they assumed the baby was still in the car when it exploded? Realistically, they were able to find adult remains, but probably not infant (as morbid as that sounds), so they buried an empty casket. I agree with your thoughts, but in real life, I would think it more likely that a single casket would have been used to bury mom and baby together, so that all of the remains would have been placed in one casket, rather than using an empty casket for the baby. And not to be too grisly, but if even Angelina's remains weren't fairly intact, it would seem more likely they would have been cremated (especially if some time had passed in order to take care of paperwork, etc.). Cremated remains can be buried, but normally a full-sized casket wouldn't be necessary or used. One final thought and I'll try to stop tearing apart the ending of Sons and Lovers--what actual rights did Tubbs have to claim Angelina's body and make burial arrangements? They weren't married and no legal relationship existed. They hadn't been "together" as a couple long enough for him to claim even a common-law relationship. I suppose since she had no other family to perform this duty, he could have stepped up, but it's something I've wondered about... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 (edited) 14 minutes ago, vicegirl85 said: I agree with your thoughts, but in real life, I would think it more likely that a single casket would have been used to bury mom and baby together, so that all of the remains would have been placed in one casket, rather than using an empty casket for the baby. And not to be too grisly, but if even Angelina's remains weren't fairly intact, it would seem more likely they would have been cremated (especially if some time had passed in order to take care of paperwork, etc.). Cremated remains can be buried, but normally a full-sized casket wouldn't be necessary or used. One final thought and I'll try to stop tearing apart the ending of Sons and Lovers--what actual rights did Tubbs have to claim Angelina's body and make burial arrangements? They weren't married and no legal relationship existed. They hadn't been "together" as a couple long enough for him to claim even a common-law relationship. I suppose since she had no other family to perform this duty, he could have stepped up, but it's something I've wondered about... True...sometimes when a mother and baby died at the same time, they would bury the remains together in one casket. But I’ve also known other funerals that had a separate little casket for the baby as well. Then both caskets were buried one on top of the other...or the infant was buried in a separate grave right beside the mother. I know grizzly & sad, but true. I don’t think they officially cremated Angelina‘s remains, and they probably just had them in the full-size casket for her. As for who had legal rights to her remains? Well obviously her so-called family wasn’t going to do anything about it, and there was no one else, so I’m sure Tubbs stepped in and took charge of that, paid for it (I’m sure OCB team helped him), etc... Edited April 24, 2021 by ViceFanMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdiegolo78 Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 On 1/1/2018 at 2:42 PM, Matt5 said: look at Crocketts hair at the back it’s slightly longer than the “Down for the Count” episodes and it says Afternoon Plane was filmed before those two episodes ?! They must have applied hair extensions..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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