Location Hunting - Best Practice Thread

[Tom]

Hi all,

as we have been very successful in the last few weeks (this weekend alone I found 3 major missing landlocked locations!), I thought it would be interesting to start a thread about best practice in location hunting as we have been doing this quite a while now and have improved our skills considerably - we have only around 32 locations left in the whole series if my count is right.

The aim of this thread: further improve our techniques to find the rest and give other interested members some insight, so that they can give it a try and help identifying the remaining ones..

I start with the best practice I have developed over the years and that turned particularly useful for finding locations with less clues (e.g. landlocked houses). 

Pre-context: I was specialized on MV music finding before the internet time and I am working in the IT industry in the area of analytics, so I have some disposition for that cause. Also,  I am a very visual type of person. It´s easier for me to go for something that I can see, compare and store in my mind. This also gives the huge advantage that even if I don´t look for a specific location and search for something else: if I see something familiar, it´s most likely another unknown locations. Other people might be different and have to adapt their MO accordingly.

My MO (modus operandi): I work in three stages. The first is the most important one. 

Stage 1: Location Analysis (Accurate Sketch drawing) - 80% of success depends on it

Before I even start searching anything, I spend lot of time analysing the scenes with the location. Often, still by still, because any single frame (24/25 frames per second on TV) can have useful information like a number or glimpse of background. Usually I spend 30-60 minutes on one location, sometimes more. While doing that I make a sketch of the whole perceived location and its surroundings and specifically include description of unique clues, e.g. is it a modern house with flat-roof with roof color most likely white, because this is easy to spot from above and helps to disregard 80% of other houses. Is the distance to neighbors or the waterway 10, 100 or rather 1000 meters? Is the roof tilted, indented? Is there a unique chimney? 

Change factor: bear in mind that things can change in over 30 years! in best case it’s just the color or it could be the whole structure. Don’t restrict yourself too much by applying too narrow search criteria for change prone factors! colors may have changed over time, so I do not write down the exact color of a roof or facade but rather if it is dark or white. That will not change. MV used filters. Grey facades turn out white in other scenes. The Soliz villa in Jack of all trades came across strongly beige but is pure white in reality). A mediterranean pink house will not be repainted to white (but a modern Bauhaus villa could change from pink to white or the Crockett house was repainted from dark grey to white) but the roof material could lighten up or been changed eg from reddish to brown. That helps to avoid wrong „mental programming“ during the search!

IMPORTANT: As I have not decided on the search method yet (see stage 3), I note every clue, not just those you can use for Google satellite search!

Below you see pictures of current sketches I use for major locations, including the ones for the locations I found this weekend and others I haven´t found yet, e.g. the Burnett house in Redemption in blood (picture 3).

I cannot emphasize enough how important this analysis stage is. If you don´t know what exactly you are looking for, you don´t need to start - you will be doomed!

If I feel that all clues are depleted, i.e. included in my sketch drawing, I go over to stage 2.

Stage 2: Search Strategy definition (20% of success depends on it) - select your tools

Possible strategies (not to be mixed up with methods in stage 3) I select depending on the location(s) in question:

Key questios to start with: what do I look for?

a modern house (e.g. Bauhaus style with flat roof), a mediterranean house (normal tile roof with ordinary roof color)?, a plant?, is it landlocked or waterfront? is view blocked from above? can I assume how the roof looks like? Can it be abandoned by now?

• Aerial search, e.g. Google Earth, historic aerials, etc.: Look from above. One remark to historicaerials.com: some abandoned location we would not have been found or verified without it, but it has major drawbacks, like the damed logo everywhere and its quite blurry for 1986, thus my take is: it is only useful if you have a concrete suspect address or area. Otherwise it´s useless (my personal opinion only!)

Pro: Very helpful for houses where you can see or assume how they look like from above (modern houses have usally flat white roofs or at least roofs that are not brick-colored/structured, which can be seen easily on Google or Bing).

Con: Not so helpful if the view is blocked from above.

• Street search: look for a facade or a pattern from the street level, e.g. by Google Street view. 

Pro: only chance when bird view is blocked

Con: very slow and not available everywhere, especially in gated communities where many of our locations are.

• Exclusion criteria: are there any criteria that can be excluded or that restrict the search, e.g. waterfront, dead end street (within the dead end street also the exact pattern, e.g. T-shaped dead end?), etc.
   
• special search tool techniques: eg keyword search on google for pictures or special real estate agency sites that allow special search functions by prize, year built or area. That’s how I found the consulate in Rites if Passage for example. I googled for bauhaus style in Pinecrest and found a picture of the consulate. 

Extremely important, as Miami location area covers hundreds of square miles and includes millions of houses, intersections and canals.

Stage 3: search method (can be 10-30% of success) - select your mental focus point 

• Single location search: what I have found extremely useful especially with tough nut locations, is changing the strategy when you get stuck and try something new. Earlier, I was always going for one location at the time, but it has its pros/cons as well.

Pro: very focused

Con: if the locations on your list have very different criteria, e.g. mixed bag of landlocked and waterfront homes, it can take ages until you find something.

• "Binge search": I look for many locations at the same time. I did not use that method earlier because I thought I can only concentrate on one location at the time, but here is where my sketch drawings release its power. I have the sketch lying next to me and can look at it every time I see something familiar and reassure myself about the 3,5,7 different location patterns I have on my list.

Pro: saves lots of time and uses search capability efficiently, I have to go over each search area only once for all locations. Miami is a huge area.

Con: some time is also wasted as a waterfront home will not be in deepest Pinecrest area for example.

• Where to start this time?  Try something new? Very important. The longer you search and dont´ find something the more sloppy and annoyed you get. Thus, having successes early is key. Avoid searching with the same method over the same area several times

BEWARE of false assumptions! especially “location logistics” assumption often turned out wrong. Just because other locations of the same episode are near does not mean a location Seen only briefly cannot be far away or it has to be near the studio. Also forget about daylight - not all night scenes  are close each other as they cannot film too much in one night. Rather useful is considering WHO is appearing in that scene and other scenes of the same episode? eg they will not probably travel 10 miles for only one short scene where PMT and EJO are present. In Love at first sight we have three smaller Unknown locations with DJ, PMT and FBI’s Russell. These three could be close to each other. But I would not assume that the dead end street is near Crockett’s home because they filmed a lot there and this would have meant that PMT had to sit around The whole day for nothing. The teaser scene in North bay village involves no stars at all and could be filmed by second unit, so unlikely that other locations with DJ/PMT are near. These are the right considerations to take to restrict the search area.

Last stage: Verification (If you have found a candidate, you need to verify it´s the right. Match with the unique clues seen in the episode. Best Method to do that: 

find current pictures (e.g. realtors have thousands of houses offered or sold at some point) by searching for addresses.

 

Practical example: The Crockett& Caitlin house in Rising sun of death, Love at first sight and Rock and a hard place I found in 5 minutes. First, I ensured that it is the same house in all three episodes.

Key was starting with a new method ("focus on and start with bushy/heavy green scenery dead end streets"). I identified the most greenish areas and started with the one west of Dixie instead of the typical Pinecrest area east of Dixie.
of course I realized the risk that the dead end street is gone and the street extended but I was willing to take that risk as it was my strongest exclusion criteria to reduce area searches. My original search criteria key list for that location was: dead end street, heavy vegetation canopy (but not over the house), unique modern near white roof-line with separate side buildings. The third turned out as useless in hindsight, as the roofline does not really come across well on Google satellite! Verification was difficult as there was no Good Google street view available. I nearly dumped it and wanted to continue with other places but luckily I had my notes with the unique half-high wall with glass bricks part in front of the house (that wall was also on half blocked street view!) and the front structure plus a single Front pic from a real estate agent.

 

So, sorry for the long post but I thought that could be interesting and stimulate others plus is not easy to describe in short.

 

I am looking forward to other members sharing their experiences or best practices, so that I can learn from them as well? @airtommy @Matt5@C Glide @miamijimf?

ENJOY!

Best,

Tom

 

 

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by Tom

[airtommy]

 

On 5/17/2020 at 6:38 AM, Tom said:

That’s how I found the consulate in Rites if Passage for example. I googled for bauhaus style in Pinecrest and found a picture of the consulate. 

Very interesting technique!  I just did a Google Image Search for <Pinecrest FL Bauhaus> and the first hit is the World of Trouble house at 9190 SW 57th Ave.

Sketches are important.

I can't search for multiple items at the same time, but to each his own.  I was walking along the South Beach alleys looking for several locations at the same time and it didn't work for me.  I ended up not finding anything until I concentrated on just one.

 

[Tom]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb airtommy:

 

Very interesting technique!  I just did a Google Image Search for <Pinecrest FL Bauhaus> and the first hit is the World of Trouble house at 9190 SW 57th Ave.

Sketches are important.

I can't search for multiple items at the same time, but to each his own.  I was walking along the South Beach alleys looking for several locations at the same time and it didn't work for me.  I ended up not finding anything until I concentrated on just one.

 

Airtommy (who desperately wanted to know how I found the "consulate") passed the test and read my notes carefully.

Google for Bauhaus+house+Pinecrest+miami and you‘ll get pictures of the WOT house, the Traynor villa and the consulate nearly next to each other.

And with every new search word combination the result changes of course.

 

Edited May 19, 2020 by Tom

[C Glide]

Like to add a couple things. The best clues are often found away from the action. When we watch we naturally center our viewing to the center of the action. Watch and rewatch focusing on the edges and corners of the screen for items you did not previously see. I have found locations by re-watching and looking only at reflections. Example car windows as the door opens and we get a view of what is off screen. A biggie is using not just what you see but what you don't see. For example if the background is outside and there are no high rises then that is a big location clue. Pay attention to utilitarian things like fire hydrants and street lights. Each city and some sections within a city use their own paint color for hydrants and purchase different style hydrants. Hydrants and street light styles have helped me locate a few locations. Just a few things I thought might be helpful. 

[miamijimf]

Very interesting and informative guys.  I'm not in the same league with the rest of you when it comes to finding filming locations but I've always been intrigued by the search.  I like to think that I have helped out once or twice.  I found one location by posting a screen cap on Don Boyd's great photo site (unfortunately he has passed away) and asking if anyone recognized it.  A retired Miami Beach cop did.  Another one was located by exchanging emails with a gal who was a Vice staffer.  Regretfully I have lost her address.  Another likely location was gleaned from posts on a Facebook Vice fan site.  They can't compare with this site, of course, but they have lots of active fans and a few former extra's and others who were associated with Vice in a number of ways.  The MDPL is always friendly and willing to help.  Dennis Wilhelm, one of the original members who knew Barbara Capitman, liked my book and tried to help with locations.  Recently the lady I spoke to asked two of their tour guides if they recognized a screen cap of a SoBe spot I sent her.  They didn't recognize the location but I still consider the MDPL a good potential source.  I've never been shy about asking for help from groups or individuals.

Edited May 20, 2020 by miamijimf

[Tom]

June 15: LOCATION FIND MILESTONE

Just wanted to highlight here what great milestone we have achieved today, after 4 weeks of intensive searches as a team with our improved location sleuthing best practice!

From the May 12 list of big, significant locations (mostly fancy landlocked private residences) plus numerous smaller ones we have found 12 out of 14 big ones and 2 smaller ones, only 21 locations (mostly smaller ones) left in the whole series and ALL fancy private residences have been found in all 5 seasons!

As every single landlocked house can be deemed a needle in a haystack, especially after 30+ years, this is a terrific achievement!

Thanks to the whole team of location detectives, especially @daytona365, @airtommy, @miamijimfand @C Glide for being the most active and successful ones recently!

P.S. Detailed updated list is here (end of thread) for reference: