ViceFanMan Posted March 20, 2021 Report Share Posted March 20, 2021 (edited) These are the TV Guides with MV on the cover that I have...the one with the tropical leaves and pastel background behind Crockett & Tubbs (July 27-August 2, 1985) being my favorite. Were there anymore TV Guides with C&T/MV on the cover? These 4 are the only ones I’ve found, and am curious if there were anymore? Edited March 20, 2021 by ViceFanMan 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IA-SteveB Posted March 20, 2021 Report Share Posted March 20, 2021 It is interesting that two of the four are predicting the show’s demise. Cool collection. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted March 20, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2021 1 minute ago, IA-SteveB said: It is interesting that two of the four are predicting the show’s demise. Cool collection. I know...love the pics on the cover...but a couple I don’t like the “negative” captions along with them. Although we mostly know why the show was slipping towards the end, they could have saved those aspects for the articles inside only. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCBman Posted March 20, 2021 Report Share Posted March 20, 2021 (edited) On the Today Show, Jane Polly told Don and Philip "Nothing lasts forever..." during an interview in 1985! Talk about a downer! Love the covers anyway! Thanks for sharing! Edited March 20, 2021 by OCBman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted March 20, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2021 1 hour ago, OCBman said: On the Today Show, Jane Polly told Don and Philip "Nothing lasts forever..." during an interview in 1985! Talk about a downer! Love the covers anyway! Thanks for sharing! Well, sadly she was “technically” right...but in 1985 you’d of thought MV would be around for a long time! If the same producers and writers from the beginning had stayed with it, MV could have at least gone into the early 90s. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 You know who Vice's most prolific writer was? Dick Wolf. Take a stroll though the Vice Wiki...he wrote more episodes (story or teleplay) than anyone else. Vice never had a strong series of writers (maybe Joel Surnow in the first season with seven solo or co-writer credits, but he only did a couple in the second season). Then Wolf has ten credits in season 3, and five in season 4, with Robert Ward taking season 5 with 8. None of them had what I'd call a series of strong episodes...there was some hitting and a lot of missing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Ferrariman Posted March 21, 2021 Administrators Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 Those are the only 4. I have them too. The July 27 to Aug 2 cover by the artist Amsel is my favorite too. It's too bad he got the guns reversed! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted March 21, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Robbie C. said: You know who Vice's most prolific writer was? Dick Wolf. Take a stroll though the Vice Wiki...he wrote more episodes (story or teleplay) than anyone else. Vice never had a strong series of writers (maybe Joel Surnow in the first season with seven solo or co-writer credits, but he only did a couple in the second season). Then Wolf has ten credits in season 3, and five in season 4, with Robert Ward taking season 5 with 8. None of them had what I'd call a series of strong episodes...there was some hitting and a lot of missing. Maybe the first couple seasons had multiple writers...but whatever they were doing worked. The changes & directions the writers and producers made/took (starting some in Season 3...but definitely in 4 & 5) towards the end were what caused the show’s downfall. Edited March 21, 2021 by ViceFanMan 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted March 21, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, Ferrariman said: Those are the only 4. I have them too. The July 27 to Aug 2 cover by the artist Amsel is my favorite too. It's too bad he got the guns reversed! Awesome...and yeah the guns are reversed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdiegolo78 Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 MV could have showed its hidden potential had the show stuck with the same writers. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdiegolo78 Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 8 hours ago, ViceFanMan said: These are the TV Guides with MV on the cover that I have...the one with the tropical leaves and pastel background behind Crockett & Tubbs (July 27-August 2, 1985) being my favorite. Were there anymore TV Guides with C&T/MV on the cover? These 4 are the only ones I’ve found, and am curious if there were anymore? I'm going to look for these magazines! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted March 21, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 5 minutes ago, sdiegolo78 said: I'm going to look for these magazines! Check eBay...that’s where I found mine. I’ve had mine for several years but I’ve seen them on there recently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pahonu Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 Dramatic network series in this era and earlier didn’t have a fixed group of writers. It’s just not how it was done. They had to produce too many episodes per season, too quickly to have a small group. Producers would accept dozens and dozens of outside scripts and story editors were responsible for basic continuity of characters. Today’s shorter series often have the whole season’s story arc planned out in advance. Such detail and precision has come to be expected today. I wrote about it in another thread, but MV had SEVERAL DOZEN writers who contributed scripts in all five seasons, and, again, this was the norm in that era. Go to IMDB and look at all the writers. There are at least 60 writers who contributed to just ONE episode as scriptwriter or for the story. That’s why most series had no real story arcs. MV was actually better than most in its day, but it’s not really fair to compare it to today’s process. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted March 21, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, pahonu said: Dramatic network series in this era and earlier didn’t have a fixed group of writers. It’s just not how it was done. They had to produce too many episodes per season, too quickly to have a small group. Producers would accept dozens and dozens of outside scripts and story editors were responsible for basic continuity of characters. Today’s shorter series often have the whole season’s story arc planned out in advance. Such detail and precision has come to be expected today. I wrote about it in another thread, but MV had SEVERAL DOZEN writers who contributed scripts in all five seasons, and, again, this was the norm in that era. Go to IMDB and look at all the writers. There are at least 60 writers who contributed to just ONE episode as scriptwriter or for the story. That’s why most series had no real story arcs. MV was actually better than most in its day, but it’s not really fair to compare it to today’s process. True, shows at that time may have had more writers than shows of today...but I’m not necessarily comparing writers of then to today. What I am saying is (whether there was multiple writers or not) the first couple (even some of 3) seasons worked for the plots & styles they used for the episodes. The plots & lack of style they used in the last couple seasons ultimately did not. The changes and “abandonment” of previous storylines upset & irritated fans, and it sadly caused them to jump-ship. Writers should have stayed with the same styles and come up with better plot lines, than they did in Seasons 4-5. Edited March 21, 2021 by ViceFanMan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 10 hours ago, pahonu said: Dramatic network series in this era and earlier didn’t have a fixed group of writers. It’s just not how it was done. They had to produce too many episodes per season, too quickly to have a small group. Producers would accept dozens and dozens of outside scripts and story editors were responsible for basic continuity of characters. Today’s shorter series often have the whole season’s story arc planned out in advance. Such detail and precision has come to be expected today. I wrote about it in another thread, but MV had SEVERAL DOZEN writers who contributed scripts in all five seasons, and, again, this was the norm in that era. Go to IMDB and look at all the writers. There are at least 60 writers who contributed to just ONE episode as scriptwriter or for the story. That’s why most series had no real story arcs. MV was actually better than most in its day, but it’s not really fair to compare it to today’s process. I know that. Which is why I point out the problem with blaming just the writers for any decline in MV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pahonu Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 7 hours ago, ViceFanMan said: True, shows at that time may have had more writers than shows of today...but I’m not necessarily comparing writers of then to today. What I am saying is (whether there was multiple writers or not) the first couple (even some of 3) seasons worked for the plots & styles they used for the episodes. The plots & lack of style they used in the last couple seasons ultimately did not. The changes and “abandonment” of previous storylines upset & irritated fans, and it sadly caused them to jump-ship. Writers should have stayed with the same styles and come up with better plot lines, than they did in Seasons 4-5. I agree with you completely. Those decisions, however, were the producers more than anything else. I think fans today who watch and don’t like a particular episode or storyline immediately think the writers were responsible for that story decision. In that era it was really not the case. Look at the different writers for the Crockett-Burnett story arc in seasons 4 and 5. Even the two parts of Golden Triangle had different writers contribute to each part. The story editor helped bring it together and fit it into the series as a whole. Then there’s the complexity of who’s credited and how, “story by”, “teleplay by”, “written by”, etc... The Writers Guild actually has pretty strict rules about it but multiple contributors complicate things further. Sometimes someone comes in at the end and does a big rewrite but can’t contractually get credit so are listed as creative consultant or story consultant. The show creator may have their name on every script even if they contributed nothing to that one in particular. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pahonu Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, Robbie C. said: I know that. Which is why I point out the problem with blaming just the writers for any decline in MV. Exactly, but many fans may not understand the process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pahonu Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 I think a lot of fans envision the writing team of a show like MV as a fixed group, like the rest of the crew on the production. The reality is that TV writers and also the directors of dramas changed constantly from episode to episode in that era. They were really more like the guest cast in that sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie C. Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 Just now, pahonu said: Exactly, but many fans may not understand the process. Or don't want to no matter how many times it's explained to them...because following that line Mann himself gets some of the blame for the show wandering off track. It's easier to blame the writers instead of looking up the food chain. Mann, I think, was far more interested in visuals and didn't care as much about the writing content. I think throwing stones at Dick Wolf has a more solid basis given his involvement in both production and writing. Doesn't have much to do with TV Guide, I know, but I think it does help amplify where some of the early quality warnings might have been coming from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pahonu Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Robbie C. said: Or don't want to no matter how many times it's explained to them...because following that line Mann himself gets some of the blame for the show wandering off track. It's easier to blame the writers instead of looking up the food chain. Mann, I think, was far more interested in visuals and didn't care as much about the writing content. I think throwing stones at Dick Wolf has a more solid basis given his involvement in both production and writing. Doesn't have much to do with TV Guide, I know, but I think it does help amplify where some of the early quality warnings might have been coming from. I don’t disagree with any of that. Edited March 21, 2021 by pahonu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted March 21, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 3 hours ago, pahonu said: I agree with you completely. Those decisions, however, were the producers more than anything else. I think fans today who watch and don’t like a particular episode or storyline immediately think the writers were responsible for that story decision. In that era it was really not the case. Look at the different writers for the Crockett-Burnett story arc in seasons 4 and 5. Even the two parts of Golden Triangle had different writers contribute to each part. The story editor helped bring it together and fit it into the series as a whole. Then there’s the complexity of who’s credited and how, “story by”, “teleplay by”, “written by”, etc... The Writers Guild actually has pretty strict rules about it but multiple contributors complicate things further. Sometimes someone comes in at the end and does a big rewrite but can’t contractually get credit so are listed as creative consultant or story consultant. The show creator may have their name on every script even if they contributed nothing to that one in particular. True, there were probably a lot of people involved. It was just the ones who were running, producing, writing, etc...everything towards the end of the show changed and did away with things that originally “made” the series...and that sadly caused its ultimate demise. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pahonu Posted March 21, 2021 Report Share Posted March 21, 2021 1 hour ago, ViceFanMan said: True, there were probably a lot of people involved. It was just the ones who were running, producing, writing, etc...everything towards the end of the show changed and did away with things that originally “made” the series...and that sadly caused its ultimate demise. Very much agree, but the writers were the least of that group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie1996 Posted April 5, 2021 Report Share Posted April 5, 2021 On 3/21/2021 at 6:00 PM, ViceFanMan said: True, there were probably a lot of people involved. It was just the ones who were running, producing, writing, etc...everything towards the end of the show changed and did away with things that originally “made” the series...and that sadly caused its ultimate demise. But I can't help wondering WHY there was no overall supervision of the scripts and plots before they were finally used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViceFanMan Posted April 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2021 4 hours ago, wolfie1996 said: But I can't help wondering WHY there was no overall supervision of the scripts and plots before they were finally used. Who knows?? Things seemed to be so “disjointed” by the end that it just seemed to all fall apart. From the writers & scripts, to the production end of things, it just sadly tanked. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfie1996 Posted April 5, 2021 Report Share Posted April 5, 2021 Just now, ViceFanMan said: Who knows?? Things seemed to be so “disjointed” by the end that it just seemed to all fall apart. From the writers & scripts, to the production end of things, it just sadly tanked. I don't think it helped that DJ wanted to move on and he probably made his feelings known. Very sad though. It still had possibilities I feel. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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