Miami Miscellaneous

[Paul Veres]

14 hours ago, Tom said:

northside of Port Bvd (Port of Miami). You can see part of Terminal V (called today) on the far right of the picture)

I see, so it looks like those lots are multi-story garages now. 

[Paul Veres]

15 hours ago, Paul Veres said:

Haven't even watched yet, but looks to be great. I assume you liked it given the post.

Watched it, really nice. I understand his channel concept is taking some old slides (View Master technology I'm not familiar with, probably before my time), and finding these locations now. Comparing then and now of Miami-Dade county is one of my favorite activities of course, so I thoroughly enjoyed this video, while learning some new things too.

[Paul Veres]

A 2017 documentary, in case it wasn't posted here before:

 

[airtommy]

On 3/16/2024 at 1:50 PM, miamijimf said:

Miami history.

 

Interesting!  I had never heard of "Pier 5".

https://www.floridamemory.com/items/show/323602

https://pbase.com/donboyd/image/78865337

They still have a replica sign there today:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/wYc4FEUpBLAGZZtDA

 

[Tom]

1235 Club (used in the pilot, Knock knock who´s there, Death and the lady, Honor among thieves, Deliver us from evil)

[Tom]

view at the end of Mac Arthur Causeway in Miami Beach looking east onto 5th Street.

The ramp turning north (to the left) to Alton Road became famous in the Brothers in Arms Ferrari night drive in Out where the buses don´t run.

[Paul Veres]

5 hours ago, Tom said:

view at the end of Mac Arthur Causeway in Miami Beach looking east onto 5th Street.

The ramp turning north (to the left) to Alton Road became famous in the Brothers in Arms Ferrari night drive in Out where the buses don´t run.

Do you know which year this is?

[Tom]

vor 19 Minuten schrieb Paul Veres:

Do you know which year this is?

Not exactly, but the cars look 70s style to me.

[Paul Veres]

1 hour ago, Tom said:

Not exactly, but the cars look 70s style to me.

I started analyzing which buildings along the street were built in which year to try and narrow it down, and then in a moment of self-discipline clarity dropped the effort to fight my location discovery addition.

[Tom]

Braman dealership at 20th and Biscayne in 1984. Braman was visible in some Ferrari scenes filmed in several episodes on Biscayne in the background.

[Tom]

Orange Bowl Stadium in the 1980s

[Tom]

Miami Downtown and Bayside 1983 (the area of the last Freefall farewell scene was not landfilled at that time)

[Tom]

Mid 1980s Miami Grand Prix in Downtown (also seen in Florence Italy episode)

[Tom]

The BoA (originally CenTrust Tower) was built in 1984-86. Shown in different episodes during that time, e.g. Smuggler´s blues, Made for each other, Streetwise, Down for the count 2, ... This pic was taken from the south side with Metromover in front of it (Knight Center station).

[Paul Veres]

Well, for what it's worth, the trailer is out. I just realized that directors of BB 3 and 4 maintained the orange hue which is the infamous signature of Michael Bay who made the first two parts. 

 

[Tom]

Japanese Gardens on Watson Island, 1974

[Paul Veres]

Just watched this recent documentary about the non-touristy side of Miami - gun violence in the hoods. A depressing view, but certainly a real Miami life beyond the glitter of South Beach, Brickell and other typically covered neighborhoods. From Allapattah to Opa-locka, the film focuses on Northwest Dade as it is made by a local young man who successfully "got out", though there are plenty of similarly blighted neighborhoods in the Southwest Dade. I wonder how often Miami Vice ventured out to filming the show into these areas and not "just" Little Havana. @Tom you might have a quick answer from the top of your head.

The film covers a few sadly common stories of people gunned down in gang related shootings, including children, as well as positives like Miami's Circle of Brotherhood which aims to engage the black youth away from destructive street influence and into constructive development.

I'm certainly not an expert on the subject, but what I noticed about South Florida hoods (define as you will) is that the urban fabric is usually one-story homes. We don't have high-rise projects like New York or Chicago, or streets of row houses like Baltimore or Philly. I don't know if it changes the dynamics through lower concentration of people, but I believe the overall view is that Miami is "not as bad" as the places up north (can't speak for the West Coast, maybe @pahonu has an insight).

As a side note, gentrification is unstoppable, and I mean the good kind like building new affordable (whatever that currently means in Miami) and workforce housing. I was just looking at what I assume is, pardon the term, the hoodest hood - these simple barracks-looking homes in Liberty City.

By the way note the lack of vegetation and burnt out lawns. Studies have shown that presence of trees and other greenery has a positive effect on mental health, not to mention surface temperatures in Miami. Lack thereof, consequently, has an opposite effect. 

So there used to be 9 blocks of these there just few years ago, easily identifiable in the center of this historic aerial:

Now there is only 4 left and I assume they will be all gone soon:

as the Related Group is building the following - see the project description below.

Jorge Pérez is certainly a staple in Miami and has been building not only luxury skyscrapers but also affordable housing for decades. The new streets look much better:

I can only assume that the residents of the razed homes will now reside in these new homes and are not just pushed out elsewhere. The website says the "apartments range in area median income (AMI) of 50%, 60%, 80% and 120%". Here are the actual prices, though I'm not sure how to interpret the AMI number directly below the price:

E.g. are you only eligible for that $1,091 one bed one bath if you are at or below 60% of the AMI? I encountered other workforce housing by Related, in Brickell (!), where the rent was just capped at $900 or 30% of your income, whatever is lower, which sounds like a better deal. If I remember correctly, don't quote me on that.

[Tom]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb Paul Veres:

Just watched this recent documentary about the non-touristy side of Miami - gun violence in the hoods. A depressing view, but certainly a real Miami life beyond the glitter of South Beach, Brickell and other typically covered neighborhoods. From Allapattah to Opa-locka, the film focuses on Northwest Dade as it is made by a local young man who successfully "got out", though there are plenty of similarly blighted neighborhoods in the Southwest Dade. I wonder how often Miami Vice ventured out to filming the show into these areas and not "just" Little Havana. @Tom you might have a quick answer from the top of your head.

The film covers a few sadly common stories of people gunned down in gang related shootings, including children, as well as positives like Miami's Circle of Brotherhood which aims to engage the black youth away from destructive street influence and into constructive development.

I'm certainly not an expert on the subject, but what I noticed about South Florida hoods (define as you will) is that the urban fabric is usually one-story homes. We don't have high-rise projects like New York or Chicago, or streets of row houses like Baltimore or Philly. I don't know if it changes the dynamics through lower concentration of people, but I believe the overall view is that Miami is "not as bad" as the places up north (can't speak for the West Coast, maybe @pahonu has an insight).

As a side note, gentrification is unstoppable, and I mean the good kind like building new affordable (whatever that currently means in Miami) and workforce housing. I was just looking at what I assume is, pardon the term, the hoodest hood - these simple barracks-looking homes in Liberty City.

By the way note the lack of vegetation and burnt out lawns. Studies have shown that presence of trees and other greenery has a positive effect on mental health, not to mention surface temperatures in Miami. Lack thereof, consequently, has an opposite effect. 

So there used to be 9 blocks of these there just few years ago, easily identifiable in the center of this historic aerial:

Now there is only 4 left and I assume they will be all gone soon:

as the Related Group is building the following - see the project description below.

Jorge Pérez is certainly a staple in Miami and has been building not only luxury skyscrapers but also affordable housing for decades. The new streets look much better:

I can only assume that the residents of the razed homes will now reside in these new homes and are not just pushed out elsewhere. The website says the "apartments range in area median income (AMI) of 50%, 60%, 80% and 120%". Here are the actual prices, though I'm not sure how to interpret the AMI number directly below the price:

E.g. are you only eligible for that $1,091 one bed one bath if you are at or below 60% of the AMI? I encountered other workforce housing by Related, in Brickell (!), where the rent was just capped at $900 or 30% of your income, whatever is lower, which sounds like a better deal. If I remember correctly, don't quote me on that.

They filmed some ghetto driving scenes in "The good collar" at the Liberty Square Housing project. Other than that they never used that area and only rarely Liberty City (the cemetery in El Viejo) or even Allapattah (most other ghetto scenes in The good collar were filmed around NW36 Street). All other "ghetto" scenes in the series were staged somewhere else, mostly downtown or Miami Beach (e.g. Love at first sight when they arrest Chou Chou). A second episode with lots of ghetto scenes is "Childs´play" with lots of filming in downtown near 1000 block of N Miami Ave.

But I can confirm first hand that Miami was a much more dangerous place 30 years ago than it is now. There are still bad hoods, but very confined. In the 80s/early 90s you could not even get off the Airport expressway while crossing downtown and even police cars did not dare to let the windows down while driving through Overtown. Not saying that it is all safe now, but Miami is not THE drug inflow center of the US anymore and it shows. Overtown is quite safe now and Wynwood north of Overtown which was a regular combat zone in the 80s is an art district now with lots of galleries and fancy go out places.

Edited April 5 by Tom

[pahonu]

14 hours ago, Paul Veres said:

Just watched this recent documentary about the non-touristy side of Miami - gun violence in the hoods. A depressing view, but certainly a real Miami life beyond the glitter of South Beach, Brickell and other typically covered neighborhoods. From Allapattah to Opa-locka, the film focuses on Northwest Dade as it is made by a local young man who successfully "got out", though there are plenty of similarly blighted neighborhoods in the Southwest Dade. I wonder how often Miami Vice ventured out to filming the show into these areas and not "just" Little Havana. @Tom you might have a quick answer from the top of your head.

The film covers a few sadly common stories of people gunned down in gang related shootings, including children, as well as positives like Miami's Circle of Brotherhood which aims to engage the black youth away from destructive street influence and into constructive development.

I'm certainly not an expert on the subject, but what I noticed about South Florida hoods (define as you will) is that the urban fabric is usually one-story homes. We don't have high-rise projects like New York or Chicago, or streets of row houses like Baltimore or Philly. I don't know if it changes the dynamics through lower concentration of people, but I believe the overall view is that Miami is "not as bad" as the places up north (can't speak for the West Coast, maybe @pahonu has an insight).

As a side note, gentrification is unstoppable, and I mean the good kind like building new affordable (whatever that currently means in Miami) and workforce housing. I was just looking at what I assume is, pardon the term, the hoodest hood - these simple barracks-looking homes in Liberty City.

By the way note the lack of vegetation and burnt out lawns. Studies have shown that presence of trees and other greenery has a positive effect on mental health, not to mention surface temperatures in Miami. Lack thereof, consequently, has an opposite effect. 

So there used to be 9 blocks of these there just few years ago, easily identifiable in the center of this historic aerial:

Now there is only 4 left and I assume they will be all gone soon:

as the Related Group is building the following - see the project description below.

Jorge Pérez is certainly a staple in Miami and has been building not only luxury skyscrapers but also affordable housing for decades. The new streets look much better:

I can only assume that the residents of the razed homes will now reside in these new homes and are not just pushed out elsewhere. The website says the "apartments range in area median income (AMI) of 50%, 60%, 80% and 120%". Here are the actual prices, though I'm not sure how to interpret the AMI number directly below the price:

E.g. are you only eligible for that $1,091 one bed one bath if you are at or below 60% of the AMI? I encountered other workforce housing by Related, in Brickell (!), where the rent was just capped at $900 or 30% of your income, whatever is lower, which sounds like a better deal. If I remember correctly, don't quote me on that.

In terms of the west coast and poverty, I can speak only to the LA area, and the building types in the impoverished neighborhoods are closer to the Miami area than NY, Chicago, or Philly.  There are/were no mid-rise housing projects and many poor neighborhoods are simply older homes from before WWII that were left for the postwar suburban developments, the so called “white flight”.  This is reflective of the individual city’s built history more than the level of poverty.  Amongst the high and mid-rise buildings of NY and Chicago, land was expensive so the projects were more dense.  
 

I would agree with Tom also, that the 80’s and 90’s were far more violent than now as the gang wars in LA over drug trafficking became headline news then.  One area of my city became notorious for the gang activity, North Long Beach.  The term LBC was used in reference to the Crips who controlled the area.  Snoop Dog and others wrote about these experiences in their lyrics.  When I have brought this up to people, that the violent crime is considerably less today, not just here but in general in the nation, most don’t believe it, but it’s true.

I also think the current model of inclusion of affordable housing throughout the community, rather than concentrating the poor in housing projects is a much better way.  It has been proven more successful over the last 3 decades as well.  The problem is the slow pace of this change and rising poverty rates, sadly.

[Paul Veres]

6 hours ago, Tom said:

They filmed some ghetto driving scenes in "The good collar" at the Liberty Square Housing project. Other than that they never used that area and only rarely Liberty City (the cemetery in El Viejo) or even Allapattah (most other ghetto scenes in The good collar were filmed around NW36 Street). All other "ghetto" scenes in the series were staged somewhere else, mostly downtown or Miami Beach (e.g. Love at first sight when they arrest Chou Chou). A second episode with lots of ghetto scenes is "Childs´play" with lots of filming in downtown near 1000 block of N Miami Ave.

But I can confirm first hand that Miami was a much more dangerous place 30 years ago than it is now. There are still bad hoods, but very confined. In the 80s/early 90s you could not even get off the Airport expressway while crossing downtown and even police cars did not dare to let the windows down while driving through Overtown. Not saying that it is all safe now, but Miami is not THE drug inflow center of the US anymore and it shows. Overtown is quite safe now and Wynwood north of Overtown which was a regular combat zone in the 80s is an art district now with lots of galleries and fancy go out places.

Thanks Tom, I knew all that info was in your RAM available for instantaneous retrieval  Yes, many places that would never be advertised 30 years ago are now something like "quaint cozy neighborhoods with authentic vibes and rich cultural tapestry". All positive change, and I wonder what Miami will look like 30 years from now! Bar the sea level rise lol.

[Paul Veres]

1 hour ago, pahonu said:

In terms of the west coast and poverty, I can speak only to the LA area, and the building types in the impoverished neighborhoods are closer to the Miami area than NY, Chicago, or Philly.  There are/were no mid-rise housing projects and many poor neighborhoods are simply older homes from before WWII that were left for the postwar suburban developments, the so called “white flight”.  This is reflective of the individual city’s built history more than the level of poverty.  Amongst the high and mid-rise buildings of NY and Chicago, land was expensive so the projects were more dense.  
 

I would agree with Tom also, that the 80’s and 90’s were far more violent than now as the gang wars in LA over drug trafficking became headline news then.  One area of my city became notorious for the gang activity, North Long Beach.  The term LBC was used in reference to the Crips who controlled the area.  Snoop Dog and others wrote about these experiences in their lyrics.  When I have brought this up to people, that the violent crime is considerably less today, not just here but in general in the nation, most don’t believe it, but it’s true.

I also think the current model of inclusion of affordable housing throughout the community, rather than concentrating the poor in housing projects is a much better way.  It has been proven more successful over the last 3 decades as well.  The problem is the slow pace of this change and rising poverty rates, sadly.

Yes, thankfully we learn our lessons and current urban/social planning trends should alleviate the risk factors. 

[Matt5]

Looking north to 11th street \ Ocean Drive from 1056 Ocean Drive circa 1985.

( photo courtesy Miami Design Preservation League )

 

 

Edited April 10 by Matt5

[Paul Veres]

A couple of Coral Gables news from a couple of recent days 

It now contains the most expensive neighborhood in the country - dethroning Beverly Hill Gateway - with a typical home in Gables Estates going for over $21 million. As a side note, while in early 2020 Florida only had 2 out of 10 priciest neighborhoods in the US, it now contains 7. California was home to 6 in early 2020, NYC had 2, now NYC has none and California has 3.

Apple is taking 45,000 square feet of office space in The Plaza - the huge residential/hotel/retail/office complex recently completed in downtown Coral Gables.

bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-10/coral-gables-tops-beverly-hills-as-ritziest-home-market-in-us

bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-09/apple-targets-new-miami-office-space-following-amazon-microsoft

[pahonu]

21 minutes ago, Paul Veres said:

A couple of Coral Gables news from a couple of recent days 

It now contains the most expensive neighborhood in the country - dethroning Beverly Hill Gateway - with a typical home in Gables Estates going for over $21 million. As a side note, while in early 2020 Florida only had 2 out of 10 priciest neighborhoods in the US, it now contains 7. California was home to 6 in early 2020, NYC had 2, now NYC has none and California has 3.

Apple is taking 45,000 square feet of office space in The Plaza - the huge residential/hotel/retail/office complex recently completed in downtown Coral Gables.

bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-10/coral-gables-tops-beverly-hills-as-ritziest-home-market-in-us

bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-09/apple-targets-new-miami-office-space-following-amazon-microsoft

Defining a “neighborhood” is very subjective, particularly in areas with islands.  There’s a small island next to Naples Island in Long Beach called Treasure Island.  It has like 12 houses, all above $ 5 million, with several well above $10 million.  It’s not a neighborhood, it’s an enclave.  The whole area of Naples is a neighborhood, which still has no homes less than $3 million.  It has an elementary school, stores and restaurants, etc…

I think a better metric is zip code, because it’s drawn impartially for mail delivery and better at reflecting a general area for living… i.e. a neighborhood.   I’d be interested in seeing the most expensive zip codes in the nation.  I would bet FL, NY, and CA are definitely on the list, but there might be some surprises on the list.  

[Paul Veres]

11 hours ago, pahonu said:

Defining a “neighborhood” is very subjective, particularly in areas with islands.  There’s a small island next to Naples Island in Long Beach called Treasure Island.  It has like 12 houses, all above $ 5 million, with several well above $10 million.  It’s not a neighborhood, it’s an enclave.  The whole area of Naples is a neighborhood, which still has no homes less than $3 million.  It has an elementary school, stores and restaurants, etc…

I think a better metric is zip code, because it’s drawn impartially for mail delivery and better at reflecting a general area for living… i.e. a neighborhood.   I’d be interested in seeing the most expensive zip codes in the nation.  I would bet FL, NY, and CA are definitely on the list, but there might be some surprises on the list.  

Definitely a tricky subject. For example, I'm surprised Indian Creek didn't make it - the gated island community near Miami Beach where Jeff Bezos now owns not 1, not 2, but 3 lots/mansions. Homes there probably average at some $40 million. 

I disagree on the zip code approach though. Often neighborhoods will have very defined architectural and social fabric, into which a zip code would tear or add "unnecessary" homes. For example in Dade county, some highways separate moderately affluent areas from some pretty rundown relatively dangerous places, though they might have the same zip code. Averaging home prices across such zip code would misrepresent home values in both areas (up in one, down in the other). Though the most expensive zip codes might sometime coincide with the most expensive neighborhoods, it would be despite the zip code's administrative borders, not thanks to them. 

I agree that a clear definition of what a "neighborhood" is would definitely help with such rankings. I certainly faced that problem when working on my own ranking of Miami-Dade neighborhoods by price. Indian Creek didn't make it into my list either, because there are so few homes and therefore so few deals, there is just not enough data to calculate an average, even though I defined it as a neighborhood of its own (after all, they are their own incorporated unit, not just part of the county).