Crockett's first car was more believable

[Daytona74]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb RedDragon86:

I noticed the real car outside of Wheeler's house as well and in they alleyway. I am sure the real Daytona is used throughout the episode.

Well the anecdote I heard was that the real Daytona had an accident on-set early on in the filming of the pilot which cost a lot of money to fix and caused the owner to withdraw from the contract he had with the producers. And I think it was sheer coincidence that McBurnie Coachcraft had been making black and tan replica Daytonas for some time and they were just able to switch the real Daytona out for the fake ones without many people noticing.

I also vaguely remember reading somewhere that the scene with Crockett sitting in the real Daytona was in fact one of the first scenes that were shot, so it would kind of all come together and ring true at that point.

[daytona365]

8 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

But then why is the Ferrari emblem in the correct place? If it was a C3 Corvette why move the emblem higher up after the pilot.

it's two different cars. this was extensively discussed in this forum before even with participation of the actual owners of both cars. Both cars underwent some changes during their use, e.g. on the one you see outside Scott Wheelers house, the seats were replaced after filming of the pilot.

 

Edited May 17, 2019 by daytona365

[RedDragon86]

4 minutes ago, daytona365 said:

it's two different cars. this was extensively discussed in this forum before even with participation of the actual owners of both cars. Both cars underwent some changes during their use, e.g. on the one you see outside Scott Wheelers house, the seats were changed after filming of the pilot.

 

Thanks. The thing I am a little confused with is why did they put the Ferarri emblem in the wrong spot if they knew it where it was supposed to be in the first place.

[mjcmmv]

1 hour ago, RedDragon86 said:

I have found out now why the Ferrari emblem is in the right place in the pilot and not afterwards until "Lombard".  The first appearance of the Daytona in the pilot episode is actually a real Ferrari owned by Dr. Roger Sherman of Coconut Grove, Florida. 

Wow! Good find!

[Mvice8489]

 The real Daytona was only in the scene with Leon.   It was NEVER  used in the series again.    110  percent guaranteed! Daytona 365 is correct, the car outside of Scotty’s house was  The replica. 

[Sonny-Burnett]

15 hours ago, Dadrian said:

@volobrian @Sonny-Burnett @CameraDaytona Someone take this one 

The video here at Volo is from their first restoration of Car1, the Stunt car. They used a Ferrari replica gauge cluster similar to mine. In their most recent restoration I believe Brian was going to replace the Ferrari  cluster with the Corvette gauge cluster (to be more screen accurate)  that places many of the gauges in the center with the Speedo and Tach in front of the driver. 

 

Edited May 17, 2019 by Sonny-Burnett

[Sonny-Burnett]

4 hours ago, Daytona74 said:

Well the anecdote I heard was that the real Daytona had an accident on-set early on in the filming of the pilot which cost a lot of money to fix and caused the owner to withdraw from the contract he had with the producers. And I think it was sheer coincidence that McBurnie Coachcraft had been making black and tan replica Daytonas for some time and they were just able to switch the real Daytona out for the fake ones without many people noticing.

I also vaguely remember reading somewhere that the scene with Crockett sitting in the real Daytona was in fact one of the first scenes that were shot, so it would kind of all come together and ring true at that point.

As I recall the show had leased one or both of the 2 McBurnie replicars for the pilot episode presumably for driving scenes and they had the real Ferrari available for the closeup shot you mentioned. As someone also mentioned it was damaged during filming and so the owner refused to lend the car to the show again. I believe this is discussed in the Ferrari Daytonas thread as well though my memory may be off. 

Edited May 17, 2019 by Sonny-Burnett

[Sonny-Burnett]

36 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

Thanks. The thing I am a little confused with is why did they put the Ferarri emblem in the wrong spot if they knew it where it was supposed to be in the first place.

I do know Car1, the replica Daytona used for Stunt scenes had the nose emblem mounted in the wrong place because Volo found the filled holes where it was originally mounted before it was moved. Not sure when the emblem was repositioned.   As to Car4, the Camera car used for closeup scenes, I don't recall any discussion that its emblem was repositioned. Maybe this is in the Ferrari thread. 

So the fast driving scenes at night or high speed chase scenes would have used Car1, the Stunt car for most of these scenes which may explain why it appears the badge is seen in 2 different places depending on which Car, 1 or 4 is used. I can only assume that since Car1 and 4 were built at different times that the badges were installed without much point of reference between the cars. 

[pahonu]

Getting back to the original question, I agree that the Daytona was probably better for undercover work as many have said.  I also personally like it better just for being a convertible.  Two of the three cars my wife and I own are convertibles.  That being said, in the context of the show, these vehicles would both have come into police possession via civil forfeiture.  Civil forfeiture is a powerful tool to battle criminal organizations involved in the illegal drug trade, since it allows authorities to seize cash and other assets, from narcotics trafficking.  It is also an efficient method since it allows law enforcement agencies to use these seized proceeds to further battle illegal activity, that is, directly converting value obtained from illegal items for law enforcement purposes by harming criminals economically while helping law enforcement financially.  Most of these seizures are in fact money, but it also includes vehicles as we are discussing.

As Dadrian pointed out and many of us knew, neither car belonged to Crockett.  He often commented on how little he was paid.  Regarding these seizures then, the police don't exactly have a choice of what vehicles they get.  Crockett had no choice either.  They're not exactly shopping around the car lots.  I suspect most vehicles seized would be pretty typical and not convincing as the vehicle of a high-level drug dealer.  Those vehicles would likely be used for more routine work.  The assumption then seems to be that Crockett got the Daytona after it was seized from some drug dealer and convincingly used it as part of his cover.  The same would then be true of the Testarossa after the Daytona's destruction.  I can imagine either of these types of flashy cars being owned by drug kingpins.  It follows that Crockett's use of either of them seems reasonable for his cover as Burnett.  I prefer the Daytona, but the Testarossa seems very plausible to me as well.   

 

 

[Sonny-Burnett]

1 hour ago, RedDragon86 said:

But then why is the Ferrari emblem in the correct place? If it was a C3 Corvette why move the emblem higher up after the pilot.

The Ferrari emblem is in the centre of the front lights where it should be here.

I believe this is Car4, the Camera Car used for closeup scenes and not Car1, the stunt car. We know Car1 had the badge repositioned. 

[Robbie C.]

5 minutes ago, pahonu said:

Getting back to the original question, I agree that the Daytona was probably better for undercover work as many have said.  I also personally like it better just for being a convertible.  Two of the three cars my wife and I own are convertibles.  That being said, in the context of the show, these vehicles would both have come into police possession via civil forfeiture.  Civil forfeiture is a powerful tool to battle criminal organizations involved in the illegal drug trade, since it allows authorities to seize cash and other assets, from narcotics trafficking.  It is also an efficient method since it allows law enforcement agencies to use these seized proceeds to further battle illegal activity, that is, directly converting value obtained from illegal items for law enforcement purposes by harming criminals economically while helping law enforcement financially.  Most of these seizures are in fact money, but it also includes vehicles as we are discussing.

As Dadrian pointed out and many of us knew, neither car belonged to Crockett.  He often commented on how little he was paid.  Regarding these seizures then, the police don't exactly have a choice of what vehicles they get.  Crockett had no choice either.  They're not exactly shopping around the car lots.  I suspect most vehicles seized would be pretty typical and not convincing as the vehicle of a high-level drug dealer.  Those vehicles would likely be used for more routine work.  The assumption then seems to be that Crockett got the Daytona after it was seized from some drug dealer and convincingly used it as part of his cover.  The same would then be true of the Testarossa after the Daytona's destruction.  I can imagine either of these types of flashy cars being owned by drug kingpins.  It follows that Crockett's use of either of them seems reasonable for his cover as Burnett.  I prefer the Daytona, but the Testarossa seems very plausible to me as well.   

Especially if they're shifting Burnett's role into something more high-end as opposed to being just the transportation guy. This is clearly the case at the start of the Burnett arc, and even prior to that they seem to show Sonny moving in different, higher circles undercover than he did before. Tubbs still comes in as the money guy, but Burnett is often shown to have more status than he did before.

[Sonny-Burnett]

7 minutes ago, pahonu said:

 

As Dadrian pointed out and many of us knew, neither car belonged to Crockett.  

 

 

And we even see the City/County attempt to repossess Crockett's Daytona in one episode to sell at auction because it is City property. 

[RedDragon86]

34 minutes ago, Sonny-Burnett said:

I believe this is Car4, the Camera Car used for closeup scenes and not Car1, the stunt car. We know Car1 had the badge repositioned. 

Do you know why it was repositioned?

[Sonny-Burnett]

7 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

Do you know why it was repositioned?

Well the badge was originally installed noticeably high on the nose of Car1 so I believe it would have been repositioned for aesthetics and likely to match up better to Car4, the camera car. 

[Daytona74]

vor 43 Minuten schrieb pahonu:

I also personally like it better just for being a convertible.  Two of the three cars my wife and I own are convertibles.

That was also one of my gripes with the Testarossa. It's like, you're in friggin South Florida, and the show's main automotive attraction is a claustrophobic looking closed cabin car??

There was never officially an open-top Testarossa though, there were less than a handful of coachbuilders who offered aftermarket conversions, but I think the first time I read about them was in 1988 or 89 in a car magazine, at least not before that, so it would have come too late for MV either way.

Even with the drawback that Magnum P.I. got there first with the 308, its direct successor the 328 (GTS) would have been a far better choice. It came out in 1985, so it would have been just in time to replace the Daytonas.

[S.FL84]

This reminds me of the misplaced FERRARI badge on the car used in the pilot episode.  Ferrari was upset and quickly contacted NBC about the discrepancy.  Its VERY clear in Calderone's Return.

 

Thats ^ right.  Ferrari contacted Mann and corrected them.  Then  started making plans to replace the corvette/spider clone w/ real Ferraris.

[RedDragon86]

9 minutes ago, Sonny-Burnett said:

Well the badge was originally installed noticeably high on the nose of Car1 so I believe it would have been repositioned for aesthetics and likely to match up better to Car4, the camera car. 

Thanks for the info. Oh so it really was deliberately positioned that way and not an error.

 

 

[Sonny-Burnett]

4 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

Thanks for the info. Oh so it really was deliberately positioned that way and not an error.

 

 

I'm only speculating here because the cars were built at different times, and possibly by different people. So one person's perspective on emblem placement may be different than someone else's. What i can't recall is when the badge was moved, and it may have been mentioned in the Ferrari Daytona thread. May have been done when Roberts was hired to perform maintenance on the cars. 

[Kladdagh]

Just to focus on the thread ...

OP has a good statement ... I approve 

[Sonny-Burnett]

For those who've never read it, this article is very informative and was written by THE authority on all things Daytona in Vice. 

The article mentions that Car1 is used extensively throughout Season 1 and Car4 may have been used primarily for interior shots in that season. (Or in some stationary exterior shots like we see in the pilot). 

 

Edited May 19, 2019 by Sonny-Burnett

[Dadrian]

I know life happens, but it’s real treat to see you posting here today, S-B. 

[vicegirl85]

Thanks for the link, Sonny-Burnett!  Very interesting article

[Marco Falcone]

If we are talking reality, neither car is good for undercover work because both are so easily identifiable.

If you had to choose one based on some semblance of reality, the Testarossa would actually be better.  As rare as they were, the Testarossa as a current model was still far more available and actually sitting in Ferrari dealerships at the time.  Along with with Countach’s, Jalpa’s, etc.   

An actual Ferrari 365 GTS/4, which is what the audience is supposed to believe the Daytona was, was already crazy-rare at the time of Miami Vice.  Ferrari only built like 120 of them, and stopped in 1974, maybe 75. And a small number of those were ever imported to the U.S.


Not to mention in almost every episode, after every big shoot-out, car chase, building being blown up, etc; our 2 U/C Vice Detectives always hang out at the aftermath; well inside the police tape, hanging around and talking to all the uniform and obvious plainclothes cops, and almost always with their badges hanging on the outside of their (unique and very distinguishable) clothing.  Plus with their unique rides parked right in the middle.  

Any criminal/drug lord worth a dime-bag would have his crows hanging out in the crowd of looking-loos to see what was going on, who they could recognize as cops, identify witnesses/surviving victims to lean on later, etc.

PLUS every time they go to court to testify in an open courtroom, going in/out through the public entrance, hanging out in the public square after...  In their unique clothes with their unique cars.

And this isn’t a bang specifically on MV.   Almost EVERY cop show ALWAYS has their undercover heroes driving around in a fancy/unique hot rod, wearing unique clothes, etc.  (Starsky and Hutch, Nash Bridges, Crime Story, etc).

I get that the criminals they are working drive these kinds of cars and dress that kind of fancy, so it makes sense that they would have to do the same to fit in.  

But when you’re working life and death U/C assignments, maintaining your cover is number 1.  You park blocks away and walk.  A lot.  You ride public transit to/from court, and sneak in through the basement garage.  You request closed testimony in court.   And you never hang out after the action.  A lot of the time you get arrested with the real bad guys, get booked with them, and then get separated off during housing/holding.

Anyway, just a little reality to better color the wonderful fantasy that is MV.

 

[Marco Falcone]

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier in this thread, but wasn’t the audience supposed to believe that the Testarossa was originally the black one that belonged to the Irish “business man” played by Paul Gleason in “Irish Eyes are Crying?”

Fresh paint, fresh tires, etc.

So it goes that the car was another piece of asset forfeiture repurposed to the cops.

[vicegirl85]

23 minutes ago, Marco Falcone said:

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier in this thread, but wasn’t the audience supposed to believe that the Testarossa was originally the black one that belonged to the Irish “business man” played by Paul Gleason in “Irish Eyes are Crying?”

Fresh paint, fresh tires, etc.

So it goes that the car was another piece of asset forfeiture repurposed to the cops.

I don't think it was ever stated, but I know that's what I thought at the time.