Crockett's first car was more believable

[Mvice8489]

2 hours ago, Marco Falcone said:

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier in this thread, but wasn’t the audience supposed to believe that the Testarossa was originally the black one that belonged to the Irish “business man” played by Paul Gleason in “Irish Eyes are Crying?”

Fresh paint, fresh tires, etc.

So it goes that the car was another piece of asset forfeiture repurposed to the cops.

You are correct !

 

[Sonny-Burnett]

9 hours ago, Dadrian said:

I know life happens, but it’s real treat to see you posting here today, S-B. 

Kind of you to say, Dadrian. Well I missed you guys also... much has been keeping me distracted in life. 

[S.FL84]

I wonder if the fact the main forces behind MV had left by Season 3 played a part in Crockett getting a new car combined w/ Ferrari twisting NBC's arm over the car company being represented by a car they stopped producing in 1973.

[pahonu]

On 5/17/2019 at 4:45 PM, Marco Falcone said:

If we are talking reality, neither car is good for undercover work because both are so easily identifiable.

If you had to choose one based on some semblance of reality, the Testarossa would actually be better.  As rare as they were, the Testarossa as a current model was still far more available and actually sitting in Ferrari dealerships at the time.  Along with with Countach’s, Jalpa’s, etc.   

An actual Ferrari 365 GTS/4, which is what the audience is supposed to believe the Daytona was, was already crazy-rare at the time of Miami Vice.  Ferrari only built like 120 of them, and stopped in 1974, maybe 75. And a small number of those were ever imported to the U.S.


Not to mention in almost every episode, after every big shoot-out, car chase, building being blown up, etc; our 2 U/C Vice Detectives always hang out at the aftermath; well inside the police tape, hanging around and talking to all the uniform and obvious plainclothes cops, and almost always with their badges hanging on the outside of their (unique and very distinguishable) clothing.  Plus with their unique rides parked right in the middle.  

Any criminal/drug lord worth a dime-bag would have his crows hanging out in the crowd of looking-loos to see what was going on, who they could recognize as cops, identify witnesses/surviving victims to lean on later, etc.

PLUS every time they go to court to testify in an open courtroom, going in/out through the public entrance, hanging out in the public square after...  In their unique clothes with their unique cars.

And this isn’t a bang specifically on MV.   Almost EVERY cop show ALWAYS has their undercover heroes driving around in a fancy/unique hot rod, wearing unique clothes, etc.  (Starsky and Hutch, Nash Bridges, Crime Story, etc).

I get that the criminals they are working drive these kinds of cars and dress that kind of fancy, so it makes sense that they would have to do the same to fit in.  

But when you’re working life and death U/C assignments, maintaining your cover is number 1.  You park blocks away and walk.  A lot.  You ride public transit to/from court, and sneak in through the basement garage.  You request closed testimony in court.   And you never hang out after the action.  A lot of the time you get arrested with the real bad guys, get booked with them, and then get separated off during housing/holding.

Anyway, just a little reality to better color the wonderful fantasy that is MV.

 

Hey Marco,

I had always wondered about some of the aspects you bring up.  Clearly the flashy clothes and cars were cover for when Crockett made deals undercover, but then he'd show up at court with it?  Likewise, as you said, having it around the crime scenes with police tape made no sense either.  Hey, it's television though.  Thanks for the insights.

 

[Dadrian]

27 minutes ago, pahonu said:

Crockett made deals undercover, but then he'd show up at court with it?  

He basically lived undercover. Maybe those became the only clothes he had that were appropriate for a court room. 

[pahonu]

2 hours ago, Dadrian said:

He basically lived undercover. Maybe those became the only clothes he had that were appropriate for a court room. 

I guess I wasn't talking so much about the clothes as the car, but even the clothes could be a risk.  When Crockett would show up in court to testify as an officer, anyone could be in the gallery observing.  Crockett would have to identify himself as an officer and if he was followed in his flashy car and flashy clothes to the court, his cover could be blown.  I think that's what Marco meant by:

"But when you’re working life and death U/C assignments, maintaining your cover is number 1.  You park blocks away and walk.  A lot.  You ride public transit to/from court, and sneak in through the basement garage.  You request closed testimony in court.   And you never hang out after the action.  A lot of the time you get arrested with the real bad guys, get booked with them, and then get separated off during housing/holding."

The show seems reasonably accurate in showing the undercover work in the field.  Not so much with the details in court or at the crime scenes.  I'm no expert, but Marco worked in law enforcement.

Now that I think of it, did they ever show Crockett getting arrested while undercover in a drug deal?  I remember seeing an episode of the old 70's TV series Police Story, and they showed exactly that, an undercover cop getting arrested by the police and booked with everyone else at the scene.  Later, of course, he was released.

[Robbie C.]

Only in the pilot, I think. If you listen to the bailiff after Leon's little set-up you hear him calling Sonny Burnett up for bail proceedings.

[Rattlehead]

In the teaser for Heart of Darkness, Sonny and Rico are arrested along with the director.

[Robbie C.]

15 minutes ago, Rattlehead said:

In the teaser for Heart of Darkness, Sonny and Rico are arrested along with the director.

Yeah, I remember that now. Haven't seen that episode for a couple of years.

[Marco Falcone]

It’s funny, I don’t watch pretty much any other cop shows for the issues of reality of lack there of.   My wife watches all the “Law and Order” series, and there is just something about those that grate on me...   (Even as much as I loved Jerry Orbach...)

And like I said, the things I brought up about the main characters being so flashy in their clothing style, cars, lifestyle, and violating so many of the rules of maintaining cover is common to almost every undercover cop show.   

My last real “plainclothes/UC” car was an older Pontiac Bonneville, dark green with an tan interior.  Windows tinted black.   Just clean enough not to stand out in a “nicer” neighborhood, but just “hoopdee” enough to fit in the “other” neighborhoods.  And no visible red and blues.  I used the crappy combo one you could throw on the dashboard, (kept it under the seat) and I got our radio shop to put some red and blue hideaway strobes in the factory headlight/tail light assemblies.    

I pulled all the interior and trunk lightbulbs so no lights could ever accidentally come on getting in/out at night, and even sprayed a thin coat of bed-liner on the front door latches so they would close more quietly.   And I kept a couple of different colored hoodies, ball caps, and different style sunglasses in a small backpack on the front passenger floorboard, so I could change out my VDM’s on the fly.  

Don’t get me wrong...  If my LT had offered me a McBurnie Spyder or a Testarossa I would have taken it in a heartbeat!   I would have had to park even farther away from an op and changed clothes more often than Superman.  But I still would have!


Anyway, I don’t have to say it here, but I will.  

Miami Vice is so much more than just a cop show.   The character development and relationships among them are better than 99% of the rest.  Then there are the other little details they get so right about U/C work and stake-outs and outside relationships.  (Check out my post on Switek and Zito’s stakeout scene from “Out Where the Buses Don’t Run.”)

AND it was the first show to combine that gritty realism and violence with so much of the STYLE of the exact moment it was taking place in.

Having gone to high school and college in the 1980’s, and growing up in a cop house (my dad did 29 years, and we actually worked together for a couple of years), Vice just speaks to me in a way no other cop show does, not only as a cop show (THE cop show that made me want to get into the business) but also as a gorgeous, semi-fantasy memory time-capsule of my “youth.”

So I guess I’m way more forgiving of it than I am any other cop shows.

The only other cop show I really loved was the Wire.  They did a great job with that.  But the main characters were more intel guys than field guys.  Whenever they went out on the streets to work snitches or even do limited surveillance, everyone who saw them knew they were “regular Po-lice.”


So, please don’t take my original comment as bagging on the show.   I’m watching it all again, (again-again), right now.  Currently in the last few episodes of Season 3.  And I will watch all until the end.  And then in a few months, I’ll start on my top 10.  Then next summer, after a few Black-Jacks when the kids are in bed...

Edited May 22, 2019 by Marco Falcone

[CameraDaytona]

Sorry I missed this thread in May.  Both Daytonas initially had the Ferrari emblems installed too high - both have the holes filled where the emblem was originally installed.  As mentioned above, my car (car 4) has the filled holes, but I think that the emblem was moved while or probably before the pilot movie was filmed.  As mentioned above, the real Daytona was pulled after only a couple scenes were filmed.  The rest of the pilot movie was made using my car.  (Universal did not go back and lease the second car - car number 1 - until NBC agreed to take the series - after the pilot movie was successful.)  I think in the first year (or part of the year) car #1 still had the emblem too high while car 4 had it in the correct position.  that's why you see the emblem to be in the correct spot in the scene from the pilot movie.  I don't believe that the emblems were ever "moved back up".

As far as being easy to drive, the Daytonas used a Corvette Chassis, so they drove like a 1981 or 1976 Corvette.  Car 4 has power steering and is quite easy to drive.  I assume car 1 also has power steering.  Both were automatics, although I think that the show producers wanted people to think they were stick shift - as a proper Daytona should be.

[Sonny-Burnett]

On 7/20/2019 at 11:02 PM, CameraDaytona said:

Sorry I missed this thread in May.  Both Daytonas initially had the Ferrari emblems installed too high - both have the holes filled where the emblem was originally installed.  As mentioned above, my car (car 4) has the filled holes, but I think that the emblem was moved while or probably before the pilot movie was filmed.  As mentioned above, the real Daytona was pulled after only a couple scenes were filmed.  The rest of the pilot movie was made using my car.  (Universal did not go back and lease the second car - car number 1 - until NBC agreed to take the series - after the pilot movie was successful.)  I think in the first year (or part of the year) car #1 still had the emblem too high while car 4 had it in the correct position.  that's why you see the emblem to be in the correct spot in the scene from the pilot movie.  I don't believe that the emblems were ever "moved back up".

As far as being easy to drive, the Daytonas used a Corvette Chassis, so they drove like a 1981 or 1976 Corvette.  Car 4 has power steering and is quite easy to drive.  I assume car 1 also has power steering.  Both were automatics, although I think that the show producers wanted people to think they were stick shift - as a proper Daytona should be.

Thanks for setting us straight, C-D.   I somehow missed your followup as well.  Cheers. 

[Sonny-Burnett]

On 5/17/2019 at 9:10 AM, daytona365 said:

nope. just look at the Windshield shape and frame, it's clearly C3 Corvette.

this is the scene with the genuine Daytona, note the angle of the A-pillar, the quarterlights, the tan top boot and the position of the rear sidemarker. Also no flares on the wheel arches.

And no alfa romeo door handle as with the replicars, and includes the vent window that the replicars don't have. 

[Neons in Noir]

I kinda agree to a certain extend. Though Miami Vice was quite an immersive experience, objectively it wasn't completely without disbelief, and that's fine. I mean, alligators on sailing yachts, and the Miami underworld getting caught by the same fellas (with expensive cars) should've ringed some bells. But hey! It's fiction, presented in a glorious way. The Testarossa was a big deal, so kinda understandable that both the series' producers, and Ferrari enjoyed the car being in the spotlight. 

[MTVcops]

Wasn’t Crocketts first car a Camaro  

 

 

[Dadrian]

3 minutes ago, MTVcops said:

Wasn’t Crocketts first car a Camaro  

 

 

I think we see him sitting the in the (authentic) Daytona before this scene. 

[Jimmy Cole]

Crockett went to the meet on the boat so the Camero definitely wasn’t his. It was probably Scott Wheeler’s car, but that would be an interesting topic to debate who’s car he took.

[sdiegolo78]

On 6/23/2020 at 4:28 AM, Jimmy Cole said:

Crockett went to the meet on the boat so the Camero definitely wasn’t his. It was probably Scott Wheeler’s car, but that would be an interesting topic to debate who’s car he took.

In the pilot, Crockett is seen going off with that same Camero after the boat chase and follow up meeting with Lou Rodriguez and Tubbs where the Lieutenant suggested they should work together...still I'm not convinced it was his car.