Writing Talk

[vicegirl85]

I've actually started on a story about Sonny and Caroline, shortly after he graduated from the Academy and started working as a police officer.  He runs into her at a wedding and as the two of them talk, they realize they knew each other slightly when both of them were at University of Florida.  Not quite sure where it will go, I intend it as a short story (10.000 words or less) but we'll see.

I've written a bit about Gina previously (per earlier post) but actually my ideas for her are so close to a long story MJ has already posted years ago, that I doubt if I'll ever pick it up again (although in my mind there's a happy ending for Sonny and Gina, LOL).  I do think there are lots of possible stories for her, given the background tidbits from Irish Eyes and Heroes of the Revolution.  But I don't know that they grab me enough to write about at the moment.

I'd certainly love to learn more about Rico's past!

 

[mjcmmv]

1 hour ago, Robbie C. said:

That's kinda the point. If I babble enough it might give someone an idea. I don't write much for Gina, but there's all sorts of stuff waiting to be unearthed for her I'm sure. And even Lou for that matter. What about Sonny when he was with Malone? I find it interesting that both Sonny and Rico worked robbery after a fashion, maybe even at the same time. And what about his relationship with Rafael? So many goodies waiting to be unpacked.

We have so many unanswered questions and leads that went nowhere, there’s no end to the material we have waiting for us!

[Robbie C.]

I'm actually kind of interested in Sonny and Barbara. Why did they end? What happened? Given the ages mentioned in the pilot script, Sonny was likely dating her when he was playing football and not Caroline. Did she leave him because of the war? Was it something else? Another of those questions. And we have the totally sketched in relationship between Rico and his former partner. And (of course) Rico and Valerie. I wouldn't touch that one just because I can't stomach Valerie, but it's another fascinating arc they never really did justice to. Or Castillo and the priest from God's Work. It would have been before he went to Southeast Asia, so maybe before he started working for the CIA (I'm still convinced that's who he worked for most of the time in SEA...he had WAY too many contacts with them and almost none with DEA that we ever see).

[vicegirl85]

I love that you have the information from the pilot script to draw on, Robbie C!  And you bring up lots of interesting potential stories.  Castillo is endlessly fascinating with his vaguely spooky background, his marriage to an Asian woman, and the betrayal by his team.

As far as Sonny and Barbara---my own thought (only having access to what was in the show) was that Barbara was someone he dated before he married Caroline, but (for me) that could have been anywhere from high school on.  In fact, if Sonny and Caroline knew each other in college they may or may not have dated, and certainly I don't think Sonny dated anyone exclusively while he was in college and playing football.  Barbara could easily have been a high school girlfriend or one he dated when he was at home during college.  When Sonny met up with Caroline later, he fell headfirst into "lust with potential", and Barbara was left behind (if they were still seeing each other at that point).  I feel like Barbara's husband must have been a fellow high school football-playing friend of Sonny's as well.  He seemed to be on good terms with Sonny, so the breakup with Barbara may have even happened before Sonny fell in love with Caroline.

For me, Caroline just never looked or acted like she was 6 years younger than Sonny.  They seemed to be about the same age.  In RL, Belinda Montgomery is only about 6 months younger than DJ, so it makes sense that they seem close in age.  Regardless of the script, nothing in the pilot or Hit List led me to think there was any significant age difference.  I accept that the script may say different but that wasn't brought out in the actual episodes.  My choice is to make her 2 years younger.  My take:  about the time he left college for military service, she started in clinical rotations for a nursing degree and dropped off the cheerleading team, so while they probably knew each other, they mutually lost track and perhaps neither one gave much of a thought to the other one, their lives being taken up with other things.  Although (on the show), when we see the bundle of airmail letters mixed in with his military service ribbons and medals, I always figured they were letters from Caroline.  Maybe, maybe not--that was never explained or addressed on the show so I think we have freedom to decide what we want to believe.

You can see that I'm having no trouble creating a backstory that suits me  That's my story and I'm sticking to it...  

[Robbie C.]

Never said my background was gospel, of course. I stick with the pilot as a starting point because (to me) that's the baseline for the characters. Everything after that is fair game. The pilot script itself has flaws (mainly in the timeline for Sonny's football time and the like), so it's not foolproof by any means.

I always took the letters in Back in the World to be possibly from his mother just based on the handwriting, but it's hard to say. Sometime I need to actually screenshot those couple of frames and zoom in, because I've always wanted to clarify one or things and that would be helpful. But I just never get around to it...

Part of it also comes from my take on Caroline. I never really saw her as especially sympathetic, which could come from her not knowing him very well before they got married. Even the pilot script has her essentially clueless about his Vietnam service or anything he did before joining the force. That shapes my view. Obviously if you see her as a more sympathetic character it changes perceptions and background accordingly.

With your perspective on Caroline, it makes total sense you'd want to do a story about them, maybe when they first meet again after he's out of the military. Given my perspective on Caroline, it's Barbara who's more interesting to me. I tend to see Caroline as an early version of Caitlin; Sonny grabbing for something 'normal' after spending years in an abnormal situation. Maybe Sonny and Barbara were high school sweethearts and the relationship didn't survive his first year in college (the pilot script has a funny reference to Sonny injuring his knee jumping out of a sorority girl's room that I don't think made it into the actual episode).

The other thing I find interesting is how much of the pilot script actually DIDN'T make it into the episode. I've also got a copy of The Shield's pilot script, and it's almost word for word what we saw in that series' pilot. Found both of them online, and now I can't track down the Vice one again. The link, anyhow. I did save the PDF.

Edited July 14, 2019 by Robbie C.

[vicegirl85]

17 hours ago, Robbie C. said:

Part of it also comes from my take on Caroline. I never really saw her as especially sympathetic, which could come from her not knowing him very well before they got married. Even the pilot script has her essentially clueless about his Vietnam service or anything he did before joining the force. That shapes my view. Obviously if you see her as a more sympathetic character it changes perceptions and background accordingly.

LOL about "not especially sympathetic."  I don't actually think Sonny and Caroline were well-suited and I do think they rushed into marriage.  But once they had a child together I think Caroline wanted more family involvement from Sonny and for whatever reason (i.e. legitimate devotion to his job vs choosing his work over his family) he was not able to give this.  Her very legitimate fears for his safety ultimately drove a wedge between them.  However, there was truthfully not enough canon detail for me to say there's only one way to view their relationship.

Speaking of Barbara Carrow:  we get to know so little about her from the show that for me she is really a cipher.  So I think there's lots of room for character exploration!

[mjcmmv]

On 7/13/2019 at 3:39 PM, vicegirl85 said:

I've actually started on a story about Sonny and Caroline, shortly after he graduated from the Academy and started working as a police officer.  He runs into her at a wedding and as the two of them talk, they realize they knew each other slightly when both of them were at University of Florida.  Not quite sure where it will go, I intend it as a short story (10.000 words or less) but we'll see.

I've written a bit about Gina previously (per earlier post) but actually my ideas for her are so close to a long story MJ has already posted years ago, that I doubt if I'll ever pick it up again (although in my mind there's a happy ending for Sonny and Gina, LOL).  I do think there are lots of possible stories for her, given the background tidbits from Irish Eyes and Heroes of the Revolution.  But I don't know that they grab me enough to write about at the moment.

I

 

I for one would love to see this finished and posted!!! 

[sdiegolo78]

On 7/7/2019 at 1:02 AM, vicegirl85 said:

I felt that Gina was too liable to jump into the deep end.  She was passionate and dedicated to her work, but I feel like she let her emotions cloud her judgment and didn't retain professional objectivity when that might have saved her from certain things.  The passion was part of her attraction, but it was also an Achilles' heel, just as Sonny's susceptibility to women with a problem was an Achilles' heel for him.  Trudy was able to step back and make a difficult decision when it came to David.  I am not sure Gina would have been able to do the same before being placed in some kind of life or death dilemma

I feel Gina and Trudy are the female "reflection" of C&T, in that respect.

Edited May 1, 2021 by sdiegolo78

[Robbie C.]

To a degree, perhaps, but tragically under-developed by the show. Trudy, I think, had learned during her early years to be more careful around people. I always found Trudy a more interesting character, which is why I've written stories about her and not Gina.

[sdiegolo78]

I find Larry Zito a very interesting character. In my mind he was a better cop than you'd credit to be or than he seemed from a first impression. That's what makes him interesting and appealing to me. And his last name sounds really cool, as added bonus.

[mjcmmv]

45 minutes ago, sdiegolo78 said:

I find Larry Zito a very interesting character. In my mind he was a better cop than you'd credit to be or than he seemed from a first impression. That's what makes him interesting and appealing to me. And his last name sounds really cool, as added bonus.

That's a good observation. Too bad the writers didn't see it the same way! 

[Robbie C.]

Stan and Larry both were under-appreciated. Larry had top-shelf tech skills, for starters. I've done two stories so far that focus on them exclusively.

[NeonHumidity]

I started writing a story with Crockett's perspective/input.  He told me something I didn't originally have in mind and wasn't planning to go with, so now the stories have a whole different orientation... Thanks, Sonny.   You really are special...

Anybody else ever have a character do something like that?

[king77]

Back in the day I co-wrote a script for Nash Bridges that was written with PMT/Rick Hawks in mind, it was intended for season 7 sweeps, had it been picked up, it was called Cash Box.

That’s how I ended up with a DJ worn screen used Bolova Accutron 214 Spaceview watch.