Episode #23 "The Prodigal Son"

[Christine]

I watched the episodes Prodigal Son and although there are already 12 pages about it, I was allowed to notice that I have not yet said anything about it. On the German side I have certainly done that then, but here not yet. 
I probably won't say anything that others haven't already said umpteen times, but I'll start anyway:
Even after seeing it several times, the opening sequence where Tubbs and Crockett are in Columbia is still very grim. You can feel the threat, but also the desperation of the poor people. The torture scene seems scary and I felt for the poor guy in that chair.
The party scene: everything seems like a nice evening. Switek and Zito are having some trouble with their "insectomobile" and Tubbs, Crockett and Trudy are in a good mood. You don't expect what happens next, but you can clearly see Crockett's concern for Gina. 
Actually, I think it's a shame that nothing ever came of these two.
When they say Tubbs and Crockett are to fly to New York, you can clearly see how excited Tubbs is, and if you look closely, you can see the word "Valerie" on his forehead. 
It's amazing how quickly they find Jimmy in this huge city, where he, according to his own statement, has changed his profession and prefers to sell electronics instead of nose dust.
I never understood that Crockett left with Margret. I would have sent her to the desert after the first words, because I just found her annoying. Also, Crockett dating her again after she steals his gun remained a mystery to me. Possibly the woman possessed qualities that were withheld from us viewers.
As for Valerie: I never liked her and this episode didn't make me like her any more. Of course, it showed how fast the line is between going undercover and slipping to the other side.
What I never understood here: How did she know where the meeting between Tubbs, Crockett and the Revillas would take place and when. Frank was dead and pursuing his own plans anyway. But, of course, her appearance was necessary to keep the viewer wondering, when it first aired, whether Tubbs would stay in New York or return to Miami.
Also interesting: the remarks of Mr. Johnston, who always reminds me visually of a vulture . I'm sure his remarks weren't completely pulled out of thin air.

[RedDragon86]

On 5/20/2021 at 7:18 PM, Christine said:

I watched the episodes Prodigal Son and although there are already 12 pages about it, I was allowed to notice that I have not yet said anything about it. On the German side I have certainly done that then, but here not yet. 
I probably won't say anything that others haven't already said umpteen times, but I'll start anyway:
Even after seeing it several times, the opening sequence where Tubbs and Crockett are in Columbia is still very grim. You can feel the threat, but also the desperation of the poor people. The torture scene seems scary and I felt for the poor guy in that chair.
The party scene: everything seems like a nice evening. Switek and Zito are having some trouble with their "insectomobile" and Tubbs, Crockett and Trudy are in a good mood. You don't expect what happens next, but you can clearly see Crockett's concern for Gina. 
Actually, I think it's a shame that nothing ever came of these two.
When they say Tubbs and Crockett are to fly to New York, you can clearly see how excited Tubbs is, and if you look closely, you can see the word "Valerie" on his forehead. 
It's amazing how quickly they find Jimmy in this huge city, where he, according to his own statement, has changed his profession and prefers to sell electronics instead of nose dust.
I never understood that Crockett left with Margret. I would have sent her to the desert after the first words, because I just found her annoying. Also, Crockett dating her again after she steals his gun remained a mystery to me. Possibly the woman possessed qualities that were withheld from us viewers.
As for Valerie: I never liked her and this episode didn't make me like her any more. Of course, it showed how fast the line is between going undercover and slipping to the other side.
What I never understood here: How did she know where the meeting between Tubbs, Crockett and the Revillas would take place and when. Frank was dead and pursuing his own plans anyway. But, of course, her appearance was necessary to keep the viewer wondering, when it first aired, whether Tubbs would stay in New York or return to Miami.
Also interesting: the remarks of Mr. Johnston, who always reminds me visually of a vulture . I'm sure his remarks weren't completely pulled out of thin air.

They didn't get to Jimmy that rapidly! the next scene isn't continual, Tubb's explains in the cafe  that they were trying to find him them for days looking in all his hotspots.

 

 

Edited June 12, 2021 by RedDragon86

[Christine]

vor 9 Stunden schrieb RedDragon86:

They didn't get to Jimmy that rapidly! the next scene isn't continual, Tubb's explains in the cafe  that they were trying to find him them for days looking in all his hotspots.

 

 

That somehow didn't come across to me that way, but the way you say it, of course, makes much more sense.

[Dadrian]

12 hours ago, RedDragon86 said:

They didn't get to Jimmy that rapidly! the next scene isn't continual, Tubb's explains in the cafe  that they were trying to find him them for days looking in all his hotspots.

True, but they also introduced themselves as drug dealers—the “for days” part could have been a fib also. 

[RedDragon86]

22 minutes ago, Dadrian said:

True, but they also introduced themselves as drug dealers—the “for days” part could have been a fib also. 

What is for sure though is they didn't go straight to that cafe where he was having breakfast as soon as they hit the streets of New York. They were definitely looking around for him for a while, asking around.

Edited June 13, 2021 by RedDragon86

[Dadrian]

3 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

What is for sure though is they didn't go straight to that cafe where he was having breakfast as soon as they hit the streets of New York. They were definitely looking around for him for a while, asking around.

But as policemen, they could have had his home address and just tailed him to the diner, right?

[RedDragon86]

7 minutes ago, Dadrian said:

But as policemen, they could have had his home address and just tailed him to the diner, right?

You are right, that is most certainly the case.

[Dadrian]

6 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

You are right, that is most certainly the case.

Sorry, I’m not trying argue “right or wrong”—just discussing. I’ve obviously given it too much thought.  

[ViceFanMan]

10 minutes ago, Dadrian said:

Sorry, I’m not trying argue “right or wrong”—just discussing. I’ve obviously given it too much thought.  

Not necessarily...this episode was really very disjointed & disorganized, strange, and even ridiculous. For all the hype & advertising it had back then, it ultimately was disappointing. Not worthy of a 2hr season premiere (or finale). 

[RedDragon86]

55 minutes ago, Dadrian said:

Sorry, I’m not trying argue “right or wrong”—just discussing. I’ve obviously given it too much thought.  

Oh no I agree, what you said convinced me.

[Christine]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb Dadrian:

But as policemen, they could have had his home address and just tailed him to the diner, right?

But didn´t they meet with their colleagues for the first time after they had met with Jimmy?

[ViceFanMan]

2 minutes ago, Christine said:

But didn´t they meet with their colleagues for the first time after they had met with Jimmy?

They didn’t really meet with their “colleagues” much at all, other than the initial check-in right when they first got there. That’s one thing that was ridiculous, was that Tubbs should have known other cops or contacts, that they would & should have contacted, to help them with finding who or whatever they were needing for the case. Instead they both ran around like inexperienced tourists and/or the proverbial chickens with their heads cut off. 

[RedDragon86]

50 minutes ago, ViceFanMan said:

They didn’t really meet with their “colleagues” much at all, other than the initial check-in right when they first got there. That’s one thing that was ridiculous, was that Tubbs should have known other cops or contacts, that they would & should have contacted, to help them with finding who or whatever they were needing for the case. Instead they both ran around like inexperienced tourists and/or the proverbial chickens with their heads cut off. 

But why go down that road if you have Borges?

[Christine]

vor 53 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

They didn’t really meet with their “colleagues” much at all, other than the initial check-in right when they first got there. That’s one thing that was ridiculous, was that Tubbs should have known other cops or contacts, that they would & should have contacted, to help them with finding who or whatever they were needing for the case. Instead they both ran around like inexperienced tourists and/or the proverbial chickens with their heads cut off. 

What we don´t even know is if Tubbs still had any contacts in New York. Of course he wanted to see Valerie but maybe she was his only contact there. Don't forget that Tubbs didn't exactly disappear from New York in a praiseworthy manner. If I'm not mistaken, he had also misappropriated some public funds to finance his trip and stay in Miami. That's probably why his New York colleagues have erased him from their memories.
Valerie would therefore have been the only safe contact. At least, that's what Tubbs probably believed.

[Dadrian]

1 hour ago, Christine said:

But didn´t they meet with their colleagues for the first time after they had met with Jimmy?

True. They could have gotten the info from somewhere though. Not saying they did, but that they could have. 

[RedDragon86]

6 minutes ago, Christine said:

What we don´t even know is if Tubbs still had any contacts in New York. Of course he wanted to see Valerie but maybe she was his only contact there. Don't forget that Tubbs didn't exactly disappear from New York in a praiseworthy manner. If I'm not mistaken, he had also misappropriated some public funds to finance his trip and stay in Miami. That's probably why his New York colleagues have erased him from their memories.
Valerie would therefore have been the only safe contact. At least, that's what Tubbs probably believed.

Great point about Valerie being his only contact because after watching last night he did make a specific call to her at NYPD, like you sensed he needed her help.

 

 

[RedDragon86]

I think it's wonderful episode and the scene with Julian Beck at the end is one of the greatest in the series.

Excellent piece of writing from Daniel Pyne.

Edited June 13, 2021 by RedDragon86

[Christine]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb RedDragon86:

Great point about Valerie being his only contact because after watching last night he did make a specific call to her at NYPD, like you sensed he needed her help.

 

 

That´s exactly the scene that was in my mind  while writing the post.

[ViceFanMan]

12 minutes ago, Christine said:

What we don´t even know is if Tubbs still had any contacts in New York. Of course he wanted to see Valerie but maybe she was his only contact there. Don't forget that Tubbs didn't exactly disappear from New York in a praiseworthy manner. If I'm not mistaken, he had also misappropriated some public funds to finance his trip and stay in Miami. That's probably why his New York colleagues have erased him from their memories.
Valerie would therefore have been the only safe contact. At least, that's what Tubbs probably believed.

I can’t remember if he misappropriated public funds...or just had the department unknowingly fund his trip through the forged memo.  

But, just because Tubbs left under a “cloud” wouldn’t mean every cop, or street contact, would be against him. There would be some “friends” somewhere, besides whack-job Val. 

[ViceFanMan]

24 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

But why go down that road if you have Borges?

Because they didn’t know Borges at all, they wouldn’t just go by 1 unknown contact in a city where Tubbs should have at least a few to check with as well. It was ridiculous...it was like Tubbs was as big a tourist as Crockett...and both seemed to forget how to spell ‘cop’, let alone act like one. 

[Christine]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

I can’t remember if he misappropriated public funds...or just had the department unknowingly fund his trip through the forged memo.  

But, just because Tubbs left under a “cloud” wouldn’t mean every cop, or street contact, would be against him. There would be some “friends” somewhere, besides whack-job Val. 

I think Crockett said something like that in the second part of Brothers Keeper when Tubbs' cover was blown.

If you still have friends in a place where you've lived and worked for a long time, you sometimes mention them or actually try to call them when you're in town, don't you? Tubbs was just trying to reach Valerie. On that point, I have to say that we learned little about Tubbs' past. All we know is that he had an older brother who had also been a police officer until his death and that Rico was well-rounded. 

 

[ViceFanMan]

5 minutes ago, Christine said:

I think Crockett said something like that in the second part of Brothers Keeper when Tubbs' cover was blown.

If you still have friends in a place where you've lived and worked for a long time, you sometimes mention them or actually try to call them when you're in town, don't you? Tubbs was just trying to reach Valerie. On that point, I have to say that we learned little about Tubbs' past. All we know is that he had an older brother who had also been a police officer until his death and that Rico was well-rounded. 

 

Exactly...Tubbs was from NY. I got the impression his older brother Rafael helped raise him & had a lot to do with who Tubbs turned out to be. But, whether other cop, street contacts, other personal friends, etc...Tubbs would know many people to check with besides Valerie.

Edited June 13, 2021 by ViceFanMan

[Christine]

vor 7 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

Exactly...Tubbs was from NY. I got the impression his older brother Rafael helped raise him & had a lot to do with who Tubbs turned out to be. But, whether other cop, street contacts, other personal friends, etc...Tubbs would know many people to check with besides Valerie.

Maybe it would have been too easy if he had called some old friends who could have helped them. But maybe Tubbs tried it and we didn´t get to know about that. They couldn´t show every little thing because it would have been a full-length film, ala Lord of the Rings. So they only showed that Tubbs desperately tried to find Valerie.

[ViceFanMan]

23 minutes ago, Christine said:

Maybe it would have been too easy if he had called some old friends who could have helped them. But maybe Tubbs tried it and we didn´t get to know about that. They couldn´t show every little thing because it would have been a full-length film, ala Lord of the Rings. So they only showed that Tubbs desperately tried to find Valerie.

I understood him trying to get in touch with Valerie, as he was back in NY...although she was always poison, and we knew how it’d end up.   But, the point of the episode was Tubbs & Crockett going undercover in NY...so one point they should’ve included was Tubbs at least attempting to get in contact with some cops or old street contacts he already knew. It would have made more sense. This episode wasn’t really worthy of a 2hr (or TV movie) length feature. There are many other Season 2 episodes that they could have used for a 2hr premiere, instead. 

[RedDragon86]

16 hours ago, ViceFanMan said:

Because they didn’t know Borges at all, they wouldn’t just go by 1 unknown contact in a city where Tubbs should have at least a few to check with as well. It was ridiculous...it was like Tubbs was as big a tourist as Crockett...and both seemed to forget how to spell ‘cop’, let alone act like one. 

You must not likes Smuggler's Blue's then because who was their back up or numerous contacts out there in Colombia? 

Hypothetically what if the Revilla's were based in LA, would that be a no go? I mean how would that have worked.