Episode #25 "Out Where The Buses Don't Run"

[sdiegolo78]

21 hours ago, ViceFanMan said:

Definitely...2 was the best! 

100%

[ViceFanMan]

Lorraine says that Season 2 is definitely the best, and anything else is just...Out Where the Buses Don’t Run!  

Edited February 26, 2021 by ViceFanMan

[Dadrian]

Just now, ViceFanMan said:

Lorraine says that Season 2 is definitely the best, and anything else is just...Out Where the Busses Don’t Run!  

We can have further conversations with Lorraine...later...ViceFanMan...  

[ViceFanMan]

1 minute ago, Dadrian said:

We can have further conversations with Lorraine...later...ViceFanMan...  

What Lorraine says goes...and Hank says we stay away from that ‘woman’, ya hear?  Meanwhile, we can all go toast “Buses” and 2 with ice cold clam juice...it’ll help clean ya right out.   

[RedDragon86]

On 2/26/2021 at 7:16 PM, sdiegolo78 said:

Season 3 was also great although it lost momentum towards the end. What i dislike about this season is Zito's death.

Season 3 although good was depressing.

Edited April 13, 2021 by RedDragon86

[RedDragon86]

Caroon dead - episode 1 - Tico dead 2 - Stone dead 3, Jake, Archie, Zito etc. The amount of resolution without death in season 3 was too much to take.

 

Edited April 13, 2021 by RedDragon86

[ViceFanMan]

Revisited this episode again. Before I even start, I’ll just say—absolute 10!!

This is an episode that just captivates me every time...it’s one I can watch over & over, and still find it fascinating! The plot (as was "Shadow In the Dark") was based on an actual case & in my opinion that makes this episode even better...everyone gives stellar performances!!   

I especially love Bruce McGill's performance as Hank Weldon, and his whacky mental issues--he was goofy & humorous...but still intelligent and cunning at the same time! Despite the imitations & crazy voices...he had a plan & definite motives. He could have you rolling in laughter (or rolling your eyes ) one minute, the next he’s deadly serious or enraged...and sometimes actually kind of scary —but in a fascinating way! 

I love when he tries to first shake Castillo's hand and does that shaking of his head and cartoon-like noises of "shaking it off" or "waking up." Castillo’s facial expression is priceless!  The music was awesome too--especially at the end and the action was superb! 

But, again the thing I love most is how the plot evolves & draws you in...it’s whack-a-doodle and hilarious on the proverbial top...but underneath there’s really some very “dark” and disturbing things going on, here! You never knew what Hank was gonna say or do...and I’ll be honest, the first time I saw this episode I actually did think you were supposed to think Acaro was dead and Hank was just a nut-job---while in reality he was right all along, and at the end Acaro would "pop" out of the woodwork (oops...pun intended!) and really would be alive! But, it turns out...he was basically just ‘Boris Karloff’ on vaca in Miami.  Very emotional and deep, as we find out & learn the whole truth. 

“Buses” was just something totally different, but still totally Miami Vice...one of my favorite episodes of not only Season 2, but of the entire show as well! It was included in a 1997 TV-Guide list of 101 best episodes of television. So, crack a bottle of clam juice (), sit back, and enjoy watching what Crockett’s bizarre form of “6th sense” turns out to be. Just don’t mess with Lorraine...stay away from that woman, ya hear!!

[sdiegolo78]

On 2/27/2021 at 1:56 AM, RedDragon86 said:

Caroon dead - episode 1 - Tico dead 2 - Stone dead 3, the amount of resolution without death in season 3 was ridiculous.

There was no balance in that season.

S3 was the most nihilistic, S5 was very close.

[wolfie1996]

On 10/9/2019 at 11:39 PM, mjcmmv said:

There's no excuse from a legal point of view, but Sonny is "human" and every human has limits. We've had heroes in literature and movies who have done terrible deeds-much worse than a justified homicide, which I think this was-and we still consider them heroes for all the good they've done

Personally I'd have done exactly the same. Not everything morally right is "legal".

[wolfie1996]

On 10/9/2019 at 6:54 AM, ViceFanMan said:

First...Sonny did not kill Hackman in cold blood! He initially set out to—but unlike Hank with Arcaro, he ultimately did/could not do it. It’s only after he sees Hackman hiding a gun & trying to shoot him first, did Crockett finally feel & know he was justified in killing him. Sonny and Hank were not the same, and I don’t think this really had anything to do with Sonny and his future altercation with Frank Hackman.

 

We have no evidence that Hackman was hiding a gun. It "appeared" later as if he was intending to use it, to suit the censors. It also doesn't tie in with Hackman saying he wouldn't shoot an unarmed man and Sonny saying "Wrong".

[wolfie1996]

On 10/9/2019 at 11:32 PM, mjcmmv said:

You're entitled to your opinion and I respect it. I just think differently.

I believe Miami Vice liked to push the envelope and having Sonny Crockett kill Hackman would have done just that. NBC didn't think fans were ready for it. That was a shame because we would have seen a hero who was human, not a cartoon superhero who can do no wrong. I am a Sonny Crockett fan, big time and I would have had more sympathy with the character knowing what this decision must have cost him.

Now, as far as him not bringing himself to shoot Hackman until he saw the gun, why didn't we see a camera shot of Hackman pointing the gun and trying to shoot Sonny? Or at least see Sonny duck down or do one of his dives and spins to avoid being shot? We didn't even get a hint Hackman was about to shoot him. Just this dumb camera shot of a gun in Hackman's hand and Sonny walking off into the sunset. Doesn't make sense to me. 

And watch Sonny while Hackman taunts him. The gun's shaking in hand. He has conflict in his eyes at first, but gradually, his eyes harden. Then, when Hackman says 'No way would you shoot an unarmed man, etc.", Sonny carefully aims, says "Wrong." and shoots. This wasn't a man who is protecting himself. He's a man who's killing a monster. 

Like Bren said, Sonny didn't go to that island to arrest Hackman. No way was Hackman leaving his hideaway alive. 

I agree with every word!!

[RedDragon86]

1 hour ago, sdiegolo78 said:

S3 was the most nihilistic, S5 was very close.

Zito was of course the worst death, its hard for me to watch that without having a little cry  Another one I didn't like was seeing Bobby die in "Red Tape" mainly because he died thinking Tubbs betrayed the unit. The circumstances of his death was heartbreaking. 

Edited April 13, 2021 by RedDragon86

[ViceFanMan]

50 minutes ago, wolfie1996 said:

We have no evidence that Hackman was hiding a gun. It "appeared" later as if he was intending to use it, to suit the censors. It also doesn't tie in with Hackman saying he wouldn't shoot an unarmed man and Sonny saying "Wrong".

I don’t want to get too far off topic on the Hackman-gun thing again, here, as this is about “Buses”...but no matter how many ways you try and make it the other way, like it or not the gun scene makes it a justifiable shoot. The purpose of putting that scene in there (whether really network forced or not) is showing Hackman had the gun hidden under the magazines & was planning to shoot Crockett...but Sonny saw & fired first.

Again, once the gun scene is added, the dialogue of Hackman saying “you wouldn’t shoot an unarmed man” becomes sarcasm...as he would never be unarmed at anytime, regardless if Crockett had shown or not. Sonny knew that.

Whether we like that scene or not, whether we think it was a right or wrong decision to add the gun...doesn’t matter. The point is, it’s there and we have to go with it. 

Edited April 13, 2021 by ViceFanMan

[ViceFanMan]

9 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

Zito was of course the worst death, its hard for me to watch that without having a little cry. Another one I didn't like was seeing Bobby die in "Red Tape" mainly because he died thinking Tubbs betrayed the unit. The circumstances of his death was heartbreaking. 

I hated Zito’s death...very sad & depressing! I think they could have had his character leave the show without dying...but, I guess they wanted to make it major dramatic. 

[wolfie1996]

1 minute ago, ViceFanMan said:

I don’t want to get too far off topic on the Hackman-gun thing again, here, as this is about “Buses”...but no matter how many ways you try and make it the other way, like it or not the gun scene makes it a justifiable shoot. The purpose of putting that scene in there (whether really network forced or not) is showing Hackman had the gun hidden under the magazines & attempting to shoot Crockett...but he saw & fired first.

Again, once the gun scene is added, the dialogue of Hackman saying “you wouldn’t shoot an unarmed man” becomes sarcasm...as he would never be unarmed at anytime, regardless if Crockett had shown or not. Sonny knew that.

Whether we like that scene or not, whether we think it was a right or wrong decision to add the gun...doesn’t matter. The point is, it’s there and we have to go with it. 

You'll be telling me you believe politicians next! No the whole Hackman's gun thing looked patently faked! Sorry, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one...:)

[wolfie1996]

1 minute ago, ViceFanMan said:

12 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

Zito was of course the worst death, its hard for me to watch that without having a little cry. Another one I didn't like was seeing Bobby die in "Red Tape" mainly because he died thinking Tubbs betrayed the unit. The circumstances of his death was heartbreaking. 

I hated Zito’s death...very sad & depressing! I think they could have had his character leave the show without dying...but, I guess they wanted to make it major dramatic. 

I agree with both of you. I never watch that episode now, with Zito's death. I used to like him.

[ViceFanMan]

3 minutes ago, wolfie1996 said:

You'll be telling me you believe politicians next! No the whole Hackman's gun thing looked patently faked! Sorry, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one...:)

Politicians are never to be believed because they don’t go with truth. We don’t have a choice with the gun-scene...sorry, disagreeing with it doesn’t make it any less true.  The scene makes it “so”, whether we like or agree with it or not. 

Edited April 13, 2021 by ViceFanMan

[RedDragon86]

5 minutes ago, ViceFanMan said:

I hated Zito’s death...very sad & depressing! I think they could have had his character leave the show without dying...but, I guess they wanted to make it major dramatic. 

The first time I watched his death in 2007 I was saying "this didn't happen" to one of my friends  I was gutted when I saw his funeral in the 2nd part.

Edited April 13, 2021 by RedDragon86

[ViceFanMan]

Just now, RedDragon86 said:

The first time I watch his death in 2007 I was thinking this didn't happen, I was gutted when I saw his funeral. 

It’s rough...never a good thing when a main character is killed off. 

[wolfie1996]

Just now, ViceFanMan said:

Politicians are never to believed because they don’t go with truth. We don’t have a choice with the gun-scene...sorry, disagreeing with it doesn’t make it any less true.  The scene makes it “so”, whether we like or agree with it or not. 

You won't convince me, VFM. A clumsy attempt to make Sonny the "good guy". Which he was anyway in most people's  eyes.

[ViceFanMan]

Just now, wolfie1996 said:

You won't convince me, VFM. A clumsy attempt to make Sonny the "good guy". Which he was anyway in most people's  eyes.

I don’t have to convince you...it’s there whether you like it or not, lol! Making Crockett end up having a justifiable shoot wasn’t clumsy...having him go vigilante would also have had an impact on the character & show, if they’d of gone that route.  But, I’m not siding with either way...Im just acknowledging what they did end up doing, whether I like it or not. 

[wolfie1996]

1 minute ago, ViceFanMan said:

I don’t have to convince you...it’s there whether you like it or not, lol! Making Crockett end up having a justifiable shoot wasn’t clumsy...having him go vigilante would also have had an impact on the character & show, if they’d of gone that route.  But, I’m not siding with either way...Im just acknowledging what they did end up doing, whether I like it or not. 

And I'm just saying it was totally unconvincing!!! I have no problem with Sonny exacting vengeance. Though obviously others do.

[ViceFanMan]

29 minutes ago, wolfie1996 said:

And I'm just saying it was totally unconvincing!!! I have no problem with Sonny exacting vengeance. Though obviously others do.

It might be considered somewhat unconvincing or “forced” for those that wanted Crockett to lose-it & go vigilante...but it’s not that unconvincing. I don’t have a problem with, at the last minute Crockett suddenly realizing what he’s about to do, he hesitates. It’s only after he sees Hackman has a gun that he’s able to pull the trigger with no hesitation.

 Once you have a character go vigilante, then where does it end? Especially as a cop, there’s no way he could continue and then the next time a bad guy gets away with something are we going to go kill him or her too? But, I’m not really saying which way was was right or wrong for the show...I’m just acknowledging what ultimately was done. 

[wolfie1996]

6 minutes ago, ViceFanMan said:

It might be considered somewhat unconvincing or “forced” for those that wanted Crockett to lose-it & go vigilante...but it’s not that unconvincing. I don’t have a problem with, at the last minute Crockett suddenly realizing what he’s about to do, he hesitates. It’s only after he sees Hackman has a gun that he’s able to pull the trigger with no hesitation.

 Once you have a character go vigilante, then where does it end? Especially as a cop, there’s no way he could continue and then the next time a bad guy gets away with something are we going to go kill him or her too? But, I’m not really saying which way was was right or wrong for the show...I’m just acknowledging what ultimately was done. 

So why weren't we even given a glimpse of him reaching for it?? No because that wouldn't have been so easy to fake. I can see what you choose to believe and it says something about you, just as my conclusions perhaps say something about me.

[ViceFanMan]

10 minutes ago, wolfie1996 said:

So why weren't we even given a glimpse of him reaching for it?? No because that wouldn't have been so easy to fake. I can see what you choose to believe and it says something about you, just as my conclusions perhaps say something about me.

Hackman didn’t “reach” for it...it was already in his hand, he just had the magazine over it to try and hide it. 

Im not wild about Crockett going vigilante and losing-it...that came in the next episode (and ultimately bombed), so I don’t have a problem with him being shown to be justified at the last minute. But, again...Sonny going psycho came pretty quick, anyway.