Episode #111 "Freefall"

[Tom]

vor 5 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

I’m sorry but I disagree...and my point does fit in with what you were saying.  Finales, though not as many 2hr ones, were happening...well before MASH or the 80s. Again, a lot of shows got cancelled before they were able to plan a finale...but the ones that knew in advance a lot of times were doing one. Again MV was a show that definitely deserved a 2hr finale, and it deserved & needed a much better one than sadly what was used & done! 

You may disagree and you can repeat the same statement over and over again but it will not hold up with reality with mid80s series. 

[Robbie C.]

8 minutes ago, ViceFanMan said:

I’m sorry but I disagree...and my point does fit in with what you were saying.  Finales, though not as many 2hr ones, were happening...well before MASH or the 80s. Again, a lot of shows got cancelled before they were able to plan a finale...but the ones that knew in advance a lot of times were doing one. Again MV was a show that definitely deserved a 2hr finale, and it deserved & needed a much better one than sadly what was used & done! 

I agree with Tom. Finales of this sort were not common in the '80s. He's framing his point in the context of normal TV practice in the '80s, while you are not. I'm also sure different networks approached things differently. NONE of the shows mentioned in your earlier post were on NBC.

[ViceFanMan]

1 minute ago, Robbie C. said:

I agree with Tom. Finales of this sort were not common in the '80s. He's framing his point in the context of normal TV practice in the '80s, while you are not. I'm also sure different networks approached things differently. NONE of the shows mentioned in your earlier post were on NBC.

I understand 2hr finales were not common...but other shows were starting to do finales of some sort if they knew in advance and had time to plan one. But whatever the case, MV did plan & do a finale and it was very disappointing and a complete let-down for what they could have & should have done! 

[ViceFanMan]

9 minutes ago, Tom said:

You may disagree and you can repeat the same statement over and over again but it will not hold up with reality with mid80s series. 

As I said before, most shows cancelled at the time were not given a chance to plan a finale of any kind. That’s why you didn’t see it a lot in the 80s. MV was given the chance...and what they did was crap & a total disappointment! 

[Robbie C.]

Unless it was already planned as a TV movie, two-part episode or possibly a new season opener of some kind and they just repackaged it to be a finale. It would have been an easy thing to graft the "driving off into the sunset" bit onto an existing treatment and then air it as a finale. At this distance we don't know for sure, and mythology will likely obscure it in any case.

And if you want an example of total crap, I'd direct you to how CBS 'handled' the cancellation of Gunsmoke. According to James Arness, the cast read about it in the trade papers. There was no communication, no finale, no nothing.

[Tom]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

I understand 2hr finales were not common...but other shows were starting to do finales of some sort if they knew in advance and had time to plan one. But whatever the case, MV did plan & do a finale and it was very disappointing and a complete let-down for what they could have & should have done! 

You are just repeating the same and not relating to what other people had said before. The length of the finale does not matter and was not used by anyone but you. Sorry pal but if you respond and contradict others you have to relate to their point. And for my part you can also contend that earth is flat but it will not get more true by stating it.

[RedDragon86]

Just now, ViceFanMan said:

As I said before, most shows cancelled at the time were not given a chance to plan a finale of any kind. That’s why you didn’t see it a lot in the 80s. MV was given the chance...and what they did was crap & a total disappointment! 

It was awful.

They should a done an episode based on a previous storyline. Maybe bringing Dennis Farina back as Lombard instead of that world of trouble episode or about Lao Li, they could have even kept Hackman till last.

[ViceFanMan]

1 minute ago, Robbie C. said:

Unless it was already planned as a TV movie, two-part episode or possibly a new season opener of some kind and they just repackaged it to be a finale. It would have been an easy thing to graft the "driving off into the sunset" bit onto an existing treatment and then air it as a finale. At this distance we don't know for sure, and mythology will likely obscure it in any case.

And if you want an example of total crap, I'd direct you to how CBS 'handled' the cancellation of Gunsmoke. According to James Arness, the cast read about it in the trade papers. There was no communication, no finale, no nothing.

MV’s finale was planned...I just wish it had been handled way better! 

I agree...I think a lot of times networks were terrible on how they cancelled and handled the ends of shows. I didn’t know that about Gunsmoke...interesting, but sad! However I think it had a reunion movie or two. Wish MV could have done one to have some sort of resolution! 

[ViceFanMan]

3 minutes ago, Tom said:

You are just repeating the same and not relating to what other people had said before. The length of the finale does not matter and was not used by anyone but you. Sorry pal but if you respond and contradict others you have to relate to their point. And for my part you can also contend that earth is flat but it will not get more true by stating it.

I’m repeating the same thing because you keep repeating the same thing...I’ve proved my point (that yes, does tie in with the discussion ) each time, but I understand you don’t agree with it. But that doesn’t make it any less true. Regardless, though...MV did plan and do a special finale & it was a huge disappointment!

[ViceFanMan]

5 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

It was awful.

They should a done an episode based on a previous storyline. Maybe bringing Dennis Farina back as Lombard instead of that world of trouble episode or about Lao Li, they could have even kept Hackman till last.

Lombard would have been awesome!! 

[Tom]

vor 5 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

I’m repeating the same thing because you keep repeating the same thing...I’ve proved my point (that yes, does tie in with the discussion ) each time, but I understand you don’t agree with it. But that doesn’t make it any less true. Regardless, though...MV did plan and do a special finale & it was a huge disappointment!

Repeating....sorry pal but you contradicted my original statement not vice versa! 

You contradicted to my statement that finales were unusual in the 80s and you were not able to quote one single example for your point. And You brought in other arguments like the length to things I never mentioned and repeated arguments I never challenged (like that the MV finale was not good).

Lets keep it as it is. In my opinion your discussion style is not productive. 

Edited June 28, 2020 by Tom

[Robbie C.]

3 minutes ago, ViceFanMan said:

MV’s finale was planned...I just wish it had been handled way better! 

I agree...I think a lot of times networks were terrible on how they cancelled and handled the ends of shows. I didn’t know that about Gunsmoke...interesting, but sad! However I think it had a reunion movie or two. Wish MV could have done one to have some sort of resolution! 

My point is how do you know the episode started its life as a finale? We really don't (unless someone has documentary evidence floating around), and it's one of the scripts that doesn't seem to be available so you can't see what was cut out or remained in. Just because they ran it as a finale (no matter how half-assed it turned out to be) doesn't mean it began its life that way. Maybe they had a two-part episode floating around and they decided to glue it together and turn it into a finale with a couple of rewrites. That would explain many aspects of the episode.

And Gunsmoke's TV movies weren't really resolutions. They simply reused Matt Dillon in roles that didn't always tie back to Dodge City or events of the series.

[ViceFanMan]

1 minute ago, Tom said:

You contradicted to my statement that finales were unusual in the 80s and you were not able to quote one single example for your point. And You brought in other arguments like the length to things I never mentioned and repeated arguments I never challenged (like that the MV finale was not good).

Lets keep it as it is. In my opinion your discussion style is not productive. 

I proved my point that other shows had done a finale of some sort...not necessarily a 2hr one. Magnum however was an 80s show. 

MV did plan and do a special finale, and it was terrible! You’re not liking my discussion because  I’m not going along with your opinion, lol. 

[ViceFanMan]

6 minutes ago, Robbie C. said:

My point is how do you know the episode started its life as a finale? We really don't (unless someone has documentary evidence floating around), and it's one of the scripts that doesn't seem to be available so you can't see what was cut out or remained in. Just because they ran it as a finale (no matter how half-assed it turned out to be) doesn't mean it began its life that way. Maybe they had a two-part episode floating around and they decided to glue it together and turn it into a finale with a couple of rewrites. That would explain many aspects of the episode.

And Gunsmoke's TV movies weren't really resolutions. They simply reused Matt Dillon in roles that didn't always tie back to Dodge City or events of the series.

From what I understand MV’s finale was planned...but they ran out of time to use it by May. That’s why they contractually had to still air 3 more episodes after the “finale”.

At least Gunsmoke got to have reunions...MV was not so lucky. 

[Tom]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

I proved my point that other shows had done a finale of some sort...not necessarily a 2hr one. Magnum however was an 80s show. 

MV did plan and do a special finale, and it was terrible! You’re not liking my discussion because  I’m not going along with your opinion, lol. 

You proved no point with 80s series. Magnum was mentioned by ME as an exception. Don’t bend the truth please. 
for the Rest:
Are you a bot? LOL

PS you don’t discuss just just contradict that’s not the same as every Monty Python fan knows...

Edited June 28, 2020 by Tom

[ViceFanMan]

7 minutes ago, Tom said:

You proved no point with 80s series. Magnum was mentioned by ME as an exception. Don’t bend the truth please. 
for the Rest:
Are you a bot? LOL

PS you don’t discuss just just contradict that’s not the same as every Monty Python fan knows...

I did prove my point, you just don’t like it.  Most shows in the 80s if they got canceled while it was still the 80s, we’re canceled unexpectedly for them. They were not able or given the chance to do some kind of finale. That doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t have done one had they known. Magnum and MV are both examples of ones that did know and did a planned one.

I don’t bend the truth, I just state the truth. Just because you don’t like it, doesn’t make it any less true. 

[ViceFanMan]

39 minutes ago, RedDragon86 said:

It was awful.

They should a done an episode based on a previous storyline. Maybe bringing Dennis Farina back as Lombard instead of that world of trouble episode or about Lao Li, they could have even kept Hackman till last.

Or they could have done something with Lombard’s son and another relation or son to Caldarone, together.  Started with those two, ended with those two (families that is). 

Edited June 28, 2020 by ViceFanMan

[Tom]

vor 5 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

I did prove my point, you just don’t like it.  Most shows in the 80s if they got canceled while it was still the 80s, we’re canceled unexpectedly for them. They were not able or given the chance to do some kind of finale. That doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t have done one had they known. Magnum and MV are both examples of ones that did know and did a planned one.

I don’t bend the truth, I just state the truth. Just because you don’t like it, doesn’t make it any less true. 

You did not prove anything just contradicted that most series in the 80s had no finale but were not able to quote one single example except the one I myself stated (Magnum).

I will no longer discuss with someone who is not able to discuss like an adult. Bye Bot  please find another hobby than contradicting me.

 

[ViceFanMan]

4 minutes ago, Tom said:

You did not prove anything just contradicted that most series in the 80s had no finale but were not able to quote one single example except the one I myself stated (Magnum).

I will no longer discuss with someone who is not able to discuss like an adult. Bye Bot  please find another hobby than contradicting me.

 

Again...I have proved my point multiple times over. You just don’t like it. I get that, but that doesn’t make it any less true. If something isn’t quite right I might contradict it—but name calling & insults are immature and unintelligent...and are obvious signs of someone who can’t handle a debate or discussion like an adult. 

But...returning to the actual episode, MV’s finale was a special planned one. They had the chance to come up with something awesome & to go out on the proverbial “bang”...but they totally went with a dud, and it ultimately was a huge disappointment for fans & viewers. 

[Tom]

vor 22 Minuten schrieb ViceFanMan:

. If something isn’t quite right I might contradict it—but name calling & insults are immature and unintelligent...and are obvious signs of someone who can’t handle a debate or discussion like an adult. 

Don’t be too harsh with yourself! You‘ll learn to discuss like an adult some day without insulting someone. 

and for the never ending broken record (verbal diarrhea?) afterwards you might see a shrink! You don’t have to repeat your statement 100 times for adults 

[ViceFanMan]

16 minutes ago, Tom said:

Don’t be too harsh with yourself! You‘ll learn to discuss like an adult some day without insulting someone. 

and for the never ending broken record (verbal diarrhea?) afterwards you might see a shrink! You don’t have to repeat your statement 100 times for adults 

...and again, see my post from before, below. 

43 minutes ago, ViceFanMan said:

Again...I have proved my point multiple times over. You just don’t like it. I get that, but that doesn’t make it any less true. If something isn’t quite right I might contradict it—but name calling & insults are immature and unintelligent...and are obvious signs of someone who can’t handle a debate or discussion like an adult. 

But...returning to the actual episode, MV’s finale was a special planned one. They had the chance to come up with something awesome & to go out on the proverbial “bang”...but they totally went with a dud, and it ultimately was a huge disappointment for fans & viewers. 

 

[Sjako]

Lets be nice to eachother guys. There is to much anger in the world already.

[Ferrariman]

Ok guys, I'm starting to get a headache reading this. Can we just agree to disagree?  "Miami Vice" HAD a finale.  Whether you liked it or not is a matter of personal taste. 

I say we give this thread a finale!  

...and as for series finales  "The Fugitive"  starring David Janssen ran for 4 seasons from 1963 to 1967 and after 120 episodes,  Richard Kimble finally caught the one-armed man who killed his wife!  At the time I remember it being so cool that a TV show had a resolution!

 and all you young people thought it was just a movie! 

[ViceFanMan]

13 minutes ago, Ferrariman said:

 ...and as for series finales  "The Fugitive"  starring David Janssen ran for 4 seasons from 1963 to 1967 and after 120 episodes,  Richard Kimble finally caught the one-armed man who killed his wife!  At the time I remember it being so cool that a TV show had a resolution!

 and all you young people thought it was just a movie! 

That’s cool! I did know that The Fugitive was an original series, lol, but I’ve not ever seen it before...mainly because I figured it never had a resolution, but now I may have to check it out!  

I wish MV could have done a reunion movie of some kind in say the 90s to give it more of a conclusion, but I know that’ll never happen now. It’s been too long. 

[Vincent Hanna]

11 hours ago, Tom said:

No. Don’t let Hollywood press fool you. For every movie dozens of stars are allegedly in „discussion“ or even „signed the contract“ but not even half of that is true. DJ had an exclusive contract that’s true and everybody in the business knew that. That he was seriously considered by any producer for the quoted movies is just a press story. 
I also remember that they wrote Mohammed Ali was guest starring in 1987 in MV and that he had just wrapped up filming. And in 1992 they wrote MV will be continued with the old cast and that contracts have been signed already. This is all a big balloon of journalist imagination or bad research. Take your pick.

Oh Okay thank you. So DJ was happy doing S4 in the beginning but only became disgruntled with the show midway through the season when we saw all the silly stuff and was stuck in his contract?