My plans for my Daytona replica

[Youngman]

Tire sizeI took off the original Pirelli tires when I got the McBurnie only had 4000 miles but dry rotted... I will get to storage and check tire size.Bob

[Kavinsky]

I took off the original Pirelli tires when I got the McBurnie only had 4000 miles but dry rotted... I will get to storage and check tire size.Bob

thanks and I wonder if what it came with originally would line up with the 195's that were supposedly on the vice car when they finished up making it in 81' as shown in that photo of car 4 pre vice there.as sometime between that and the pilot it was changed to the 235's either that or the production crew changed it.plus there was an odd mention of new rubber in out where the busses dont run for the car during S2, kinda wondering if that episode was supposed to take place after Son's and lovers where they deflated the tires on car 4 to simulate it being shot and thus that line was put in.

[Kavinsky]

Now with top speed and maneuverability what you have to remember is that a 180 MPH is literally 3 miles a minute and for that kind of speed you need a long clear straightaway with no one in the way:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHVG5En_FYQ

and to be deliberate and careful with your moves, note how he's basically sitting in the middle of two lanes with the thing until a car comes along, not to mention the gas consumption. if it wasnt for that 30 gallon tank he would probably be out of gas at that speed in about 30 miles.and the wear and tear on the motor at those RPM speeds, if that engine has any faults or any sort of oil problems, well god help ya when you pull it into the dealership and get the bill!and even with racetracks cars that go that fast usually end up averaging a top speed of a 140 MPH, hell I remember coming across a video of them at laguna with a 250 GTO, a car with a top speed of a 170 mph and its average speed was 144meaning that really the speed and power you use outside of maybe long, REALLY long stretches of road in europe would be about a 130 to a 150 out of the motor.hell I still remember getting passed by a 911 in rush hour traffic doing a 140 mph on the autobahn, one mistake and that's one less volkswaggen in the world and my father was already pushing a 110 in a 4 cylinder BMV on that family trip to keep up with the traffic in the fast lane. flew by us like nothing, so even in germany to use that kind of speed as irresponsibly as that porsche driver was in rush hour traffic is downright dangerous.and that was a 140, let alone a 174, so its not the kind of speed I would want to use on a daily basis, hell 90 is enough to get around at a good pace for long straights here on the highway.so a supercar to me kind of only really needs truth be told 2 1/2 miles a minute potental, a 150 to a 160, even 3 is pushing it, let alone the 4 modern supercars are pushing and even back in the day of the TR there was two supercars that could do that, the mclarren F1 and the RUF porsche 911 yellowbirdwho's test driver a few years after handling that monster died in a 911 race at the same track where he pumped that thing up to 220, probably the same thing that put my fathers co worker in the hospital for 6 months, the things weight shifted on the rear end causing a spin out.the live axel thing only made MUCH worse by having the entire weight of the engine back there, that is NOT a forgiving design in the slightest even with todays modern aids.hell only way you'd get me in a porsche is if it was one of the 914's modern descendants, the cayman and even then I've heard the tire wear is on par with that of the NSX from its mid engine design thanks to the weight of that 6 cylinder, no thanks brother.my father was smart enough to stay away from the 911 when it slipped out from under him on the test drive and go for the 4 powered 914 instead and I'm going to follow that same advice, swing axel or no swing axel, NO 911's!the other thing is with those hypercars the price of a set of tires is astronomical, a set of tires on the buggati veyron is about 13,000 bucks and even then the engineers do not know how long those tires are going to hold at that kind of speed and tire pressure, that kind of speed being 250 MPH.plus in 30 minutes at that kind of speed even with a large tank it'll be out of gas in 15 minutes at that rate.hell that's one of the reason's BMV's are limited to a 155 mph, because of how expensive the parts and everything else would go up for rigging the car up for a 170 MPH speed.and from what I've heard in that veyron it feels like your doing 50 mph in the thing at really high speed, like theres no sense of speedand if there isnt what's the point and that's part of the reason why people love classic cars, just because it feels faster at a lower speed that are easier to achieve:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=cA-ubyQvaic

so a 135 top speed with a carbed small block which was proven by road and track in 1977 with a C3 vette 350 and rowley with a rebodied one in a magazine article with an auto and probably a 150 with a big block doesnt bother me at all, mind you there is another point with a 3 mile a minute car I didnt makeat a 140 and a 150 MPH the daytona wasnt breathing at all and at that speed once its up to it it wouldnt be using that much gas to retain that speed and would make quite an impressive average speed and mileage

at a much lower RPM than what the 454 would need to be going to even reach that speed.and that's why those 180 MPH cars are rigged up that way where they have all there power in the top end, not the low like an american car. that's where the europeans use them where over here you have the most fun between 40 - 90 and probably 60 to a 120 in a drag race.its basically a cultural difference, hell here in MA no one would ever be courteous and get out of your way if you ever drove a 911 like that guy in germany on the highway here, hence why we dont have roads like that here sadly, partly because they dont teach that to kids in driving school along with how to drive a manual.so for a 180 car to have an average speed of a 140 to a 150 at a non destructive RPM does make sense in the grand tourer kind of design where their roads are that long and drivabile with people who have been taught to get the hell out of the way when they see a fast car coming up and blinking the lights along with how to drive a manual properly.as over there they needed to average higher speeds to get around in good time and that's why now with american cars competing for a rich mans money are now on par top end wise with european cars.because that's what people want now as were no where near as issolated knowledge wise about the other ways of the world now thanks to the internet, sadly that has also diminshed the coolness of exotics greatly:

there now just italian toys, nothing cool about them anymore to me, there not hidden jems like they used to be, also part of the reason why I like the daytona, it'll never be something that's as uncool as that lambo there that gets more guys than girls looking at it.which while I understand it has its fans and all that given its rocketship design, I just dont see the appeal anymore, its just a rebodied audi V12 with 4 wheel drive and a sleak body on it, nothing really special or exotic anymore.the thrill is gone and that's a lamborghini man saying that, I even kinda liked the bizzare cala prototype that never came out.

hell I'd sooner buy the daytona, the welcraft and probably have change left over for small home and an original audi quattro, before I would think of spending that kind of money on that modern audi supercar.also the lamborghini thing will tie in with the interior.

[Kavinsky]

and that 160 thing is also why alot of ferrari guys gravitate towards the ferrari 308, its top speed was a 150 - 160 vs the 130 of the stock small block corvetteand incidentally one of the first scenes of magnum PI was him racing a middle 70's corvette in the 308 in the pilot.because quote on quote from the people who own and have driven the modern ones, the modern ones are just too fast to use safely everyday. I got that answer when I asked the ferrari guys about how they keep themselves from kicking the thing in the ass constantly.and that was one of the answers, one of the guys deliberately keeps himself in the old ones because of that, the next one was to think of the safety of the other drivers.and also the modern ones are sub 4 second cars to 60, while the daytona and the other cars were usually in the 5 second range, daytona's 5.7 and I think the 308 is around there too.so unless you really know how to handle something like that and the speed that they can produce well even with all the aids in the world your going to drive yourself up a cliff. So there really is such a thing as too much power and too much speednot unlike what happens with .44 magnum revolvers and rifles over 30 - 06, if the person cant handle the thing its very possible they could kill themselves with it by accident.hell anything with serious rifle recoil of something like a .338 winchester magnum with a wood butstocl wwill eventually loosen and knock the retina of your eye out just from the recoil without some sort of serious shock absorbing butt stock and with a magnum revolver there have been people who have accidentally shot themselves in the head from the recoil even with the now heavily superseded .44 magnum when they came out in the 50'smade worse by the fact that supercar makers are going out of there way to make the cars feel more civilian at low speeds, not really giving you an indication of the monster power and potental sitting behind you. meaning if your not aware of it it could very well bite you in the ass midcorner when you give it a little more gas like you do in a normal car.so atleast with the old ones you know to be careful and that your very much flying by the seat of your pants like in a single engined prop aircraft.and ironically because of that the old ones are probably safer just because of that.

[Kavinsky]

and those reasons are why cars like my old man's porsche 914

his was a 69', one of the very first made in white with a black interiorand the fiat 124 spyder, a 67, one of the first again which was according to him a much nicer, sorted and better car than what the 914 was outside of a needed brake upgrade in the front, are what the enthusiasts usually drive

along with alfa romeo's hence why its not uncommon to hear people say your not a gearhead till you own an alfa, with good reason.and those are usually small nimble cars, with decent gas mileage and a decent top end, usually about 110 to 130 MPHfunny thing was though that Jurrasic had mentioned the car before his daytona was a BMW Z3 with a vague manual box that he hated, along the same lines of the 914's box in the early ones.hell even the porsche mag excellence makes mention of that with the early ones which supposedly even applied to the 914 - 6.and that's the key about a manual box its gotta be precise and easy to shift it into the gear you want. hell I've tried the box on the new golf R in the showroom when my car was getting a checkup and well even the guy incharge of moving the cars had trouble finding the gears in the stupid thing, namely 1st and reverse when trying to park them.so the problem with the early pre 1973 914's and BMW Z3's are still out there, hell I heard the box on the auto version for the Z3 is as bad as the manual.and that's also one of the other nice things when having a car that was made during the amercian muscle car era, you can switch out the gearing for a higher or lower one that suits your needs and wants of the car to change its acceleration.where as with a 914 well you probably gotta make it up as you go and I've never heard of anyone modifying the box on a Z3 or a miata.

[Kavinsky]

Thing is though, I don't know with cars like that I wouldn't ever feel comfortable with one and with the kind of money my old man was making in the 1960's I would have sooner bought an Alfa Romeo Montreal before even considering a 124, the 914 or the Opel GT he looked at and test drove before he left Germany.and that's the other thing, I dont know how someone could feel comfortable with such a small car like that. Especially when looking at how small the 914 looks compared to other traffic at the end of that video and I have seen them in person and they are that small.and there has been one or two fiat 124 spyders of different vintages here.so the only one I would feel comfortable with would be a bigger car, something like the alfa romeo montreal, a V8. Anything under that feels small discounting the small cars with V8's dumped in them like the cobra and the ford powered sunbeam tiger.of note though he has always regretted passing on the car from fletch there, the alfa romeo 2000 which I think either ferrari man or cooper owns and that does tie in with the daytona interior as well.

[Kavinsky]

And that's the most intriguing thing about the daytona, its interior.With its burlwood center console:reworked dash pad with rust colored accents to match the center console, which has now been replaced with a matt black one:http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=5832&d=1335318476http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6981&stc=1&d=1351229905and door panels that I'm starting to believe were molded around the custom seats that were removed after the pilot.given how it starts further up at the end like it linked up with something.custom shift knob and the seats of the pilot it's a unique combination of styles of other cars mixed in with traditonal ferrari colors

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRrfkvhDSCs

saddle leather, black carpet and accents. burlwood center console like on an alfa and a carpeted accent under the dash to sort of make it look like its got wood under the dash at either side as well.the wood is remencient of an alfa romeo and it would be easy enough to replace it the momo veloce with a nardi wood wheel that would match the color of the burlwood for the complete italian effect:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IXUCQt2L7Y

or with a Momo Indy:http://corvette.canney.net/webvettes/customized/c0072/index.htmlthe vilationi mirrors also being a piece commonly used on italian alfa's and I dont know if this was by design or by accident but the interior heavily reminds me of the miurahttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6981&stc=1&d=1351229905http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6982&stc=1&d=1351230793http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6983&stc=1&d=1351230795http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6984&stc=1&d=1351230797which also had an interior to match the coolness of its chasis and body and was utterly beautiful and that's what the daytona's custom interior reminds me of, the miuraso you've got the beautiful body of the daytona mixed in with a ladder chasis with all around independent suspension, disc brakes, american motor and an interior that Mark Chinetti really did a beautiful job with.

[Kavinsky]

its kind of a corvette version of a Iso Grifo, The AC ACE or a Monteverdi which were the original hybrids, american motors, euro like chasis's and coach work:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=0R0qZAo1lfg

Monteverdihttp://www.jaylenosgarage.com/collections/sports-cars/plus the body of the replicas can be modified accordingly to the users preference, its really quite an usual piece, a replica that works because it has enough of the old car in it mixed in with the new.and this isnt the first time a corvette has been rebodied to look italian either

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=PT_hkItHWRo&feature=plcp

and that was a project headed by Shelby and guess who shot it down, the idiots at the top in GM, really starting to think they only like money sometimes.

[Kavinsky]

hmm just thinking something over, wonder how it would look if the mirrors were brought back to where the door handles are on the inside?http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7091&stc=1&d=1352328137maybe that would give the car an interesting symmetry there on the exterior? although with the tornado mirrors I believe that with the electric ones you can move the mirrors inside of the housing regardless of the placement of the angle of the mirror. so that would rectify the problem moving them that far back would create, plus I normally drive with the mirrors heavily angled away from me anywaysditto with the rear mirror, I usually drive with it in the nighttime setting in the daytime setting to reduce the amount of glare the mirrors give off and then move my head over to see where people are.so they would be mounted inwards at a 40 degree angle away from me towards the front of the car anyways, if I'm getting the geometry correctand looking at Jurrasics and the 16 inch 60 wire wheels I'm starting to think that there using the same 215/60/R15 tireslike maybe he tried 15's like the actual car and then found it didnt match the look of the actual car, so he upped it an inch and I can just barely make out 60/R15 on it, it may be 235's actually.its one or the other.but I atleast got a good idea of what the 16 inch one is using, I just love the look of it with the bigger tires, seems to mimic the actual car abit beter with them. Not sure how that would effect the handling though.nor the aerodynamics, it might be able to hold onto the road better with the 14's with tires ment for the 15's on them, probably better with the rake that Sonny Burnett's has with the 215's in the front and the 255's in the rear like a big drag carand towards the end of the daytona's run the era of the wide rear tire kicked in and you can see that on the daytona used in the top gear episode celebrating its 40th anniversary

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBBy-4tnWoM

interestingly enough thought the stock rimsize for both the C3 and C2 is 15 inches, one with a 215 sized tire, the C3

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5lMFeCz2Fw

and the C2 has 205's with 75 tread or whatever that means, dont quite understand the first two parts of the tire codes too well.

although if the tires too high and the tread is too thin the look of the car looks heavily off, like its on stilts at 0:35

hell could be 205's on that mixed in with 15'sso seeing as the first cars had 14 inch rims on it the replicas might be designed with only that in mind and the 16 inch one was a happy accident as I've seen others along with that one with bigger rims and they don't look quiet right:http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7090&stc=1&d=1352328132and even the testarossa had 14 inch rims mixed in with 235 tires, it was just completely hidden in the wheel arches of the car. I believe it was 235 and 255's on the rear or bigger. there was a thread on ferrari chat about it and apparently rear tires are getting hard to find for the testarossa's because of it, as pirelli only makes them once in like 5 or 10 years.also I found out when checking that part number for the mirrors on that 79' 308 that someone gave me the wrong manufacturer and parts code, those are the square mirrors of the 328.so I'm now trying to find out what they are again, it may have been a one off deal with the early 308's before they were switched for there middle 80's mirrors.also on the topic of the 308 I think a trick that could be used to make the replicas seem more ferrari like is to use the same thing they did, a deeper black for the windshield trim along with blacking out the chrome to match it:like Ace did with his with the Carl Roberts windshield trim:

it might actually be a gloss black on the 308 there like some cars have been using on there cars nowadays, volkswaggen in particular with the Tiguan.the other thing is that matt black (atleast the one on the 78 - 82 trim for the vette) when it ages has a tendency to get a very faint brown tint, sort of an earth brown. Its faint but it starts to look like aged rubber basically. So a deeper black with maybe a matt/flat coat over it would possibily remedy that.it would also depend on the tint, as theres supposedly 600 shades of black out there, yeah figure that one out and this being one of them:

which looks more silver than rubber like in the light.I came across that when I was looking for a 230/60/R15 tire to see what that would look like with a slightly thinner tire on a car and ironically found it on a motorcycle.AVON AM21 230/60-15 namelyand also match the mirrors better, which has its own shade of matt black, probably part of the reason why the stock windshield trim in matt seems to go along with it better than gloss:as you've got two different color tones next to each other the other way giving off different light frequencies so it might make it look a little less professional that way and make them seem less organic next to the cars bodyas that means that anything above the top of the car is matt with the stock windshield trim.

[Kavinsky]

Just reading up on the tire code thing, now the way it works is that 215 is the tread width in millimeters and the number next to it is a percentage.basically the tire is about 60 or 70% in height of the tire width, which is what 215/60 means on an american tires, some use different codes based on the metric system in Europeand R15 is self explanatory, its what rim size the tire was ment forwith a set of numbers after it denoting its weight and speed ratinghttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7095&stc=1&d=1352411133which is what the 94 and h stand for on this tire, H is the speed rating which is of a 130 mph, 94 is the weight limit of either tire, which means each tire is rigged up to take 1,400 pounds of weight at a 130 mph, roughly the top end of a C3 vette that has an unmodified 350 small block in it.1,400 x 4 = 5,600 pounds means that in total all of the tires in unison can take the weight of the car which is 3,300 pounds for a stock C3 vettenow with the vice car the tires were put on pre 91' which means it has a different set of end tire codes for that after the first two codes. VR which is the speed limit over a 130 MPH but I do know that on the ferrari testarossa it was rated for Y tires a step higher I believe for cars going over a 185 mph but the actual cars did come with VR's, Michelin though:http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7094&stc=1&d=1352411130which will have bearing on the next bit after this when it comes to the look of pre 1980's ferari'sand you can see it on the actual cars tires here, seems like there was 3 speed ratings pre 1991 and after that they changed it up to better denote what the tires did what.pre that SR was 110, HR 130 and VR over a 130 with Y being for cars like the testarossa that could potentally do over a 185 MPH which is why the testarossa had the Y rated oneshowever both the countach and the TR in there stock forms ran out of puff at a 175 to a 180, so it was probably ment more for the 288 GTO and F40, so maybe they saved money buy buying it bulk for most of the cars in the 1980's.and the P6 is probably the weight rating that Pirrelli used back then or still does, I dont know:its a little tricky to follow sometimes, leading to the confusion I had about it, some manufactures have a different way of conveying the tire information. Like there own kind of language almost for the same exact thing.like they need a law to mandate that they all do it the same way, which is what finally forced them to put down the actual horsepower rating as it was in 1972 instead of as exaggerated before it was installed in the car with everything running on it.

[Matt5]

http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7095&stc=1&d=1352411133which is what the 94 and h stand for on this tire, H is the speed rating which is of a 130 mph, 94 is the weight limit of either tire, which means each tire is rigged up to take 1,400 pounds of weight at a 130 mph, roughly the top end of a C3 vette that has an unmodified 350 small block in it.1,400 x 4 = 5,600 pounds means that in total all of the tires in unison can take the weight of the car which is 3,300 pounds for a stock C3 vettenow with the vice car the tires were put on pre 91' which means it has a different set of end tire codes for that after the first two codes. VR which is the speed limit over a 130 MPH but I do know that on the ferrari testarossa it was rated for Y tires a step higher I believe for cars going over a 185 mph but the actual cars did come with VR's, Michelin though:http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7094&stc=1&d=1352411130which will have bearing on the next bit after this when it comes to the look of pre 1980's ferari'sand you can see it on the actual cars tires here, seems like there was 3 speed ratings pre 1991 and after that they changed it up to better denote what the tires did what.pre that SR was 110, HR 130 and VR over a 130 with Y being for cars like the testarossa that could potentally do over a 185 MPH which is why the testarossa had the Y rated oneshowever both the countach and the TR in there stock forms ran out of puff at a 175 to a 180, so it was probably ment more for the 288 GTO and F40, so maybe they saved money buy buying it bulk for most of the cars in the 1980's.and the P6 is probably the weight rating that Pirrelli used back then or still does, I dont know:its a little tricky to follow sometimes, leading to the confusion I had about it, some manufactures have a different way of conveying the tire information. Like there own kind of language almost for the same exact thing.like they need a law to mandate that they all do it the same way, which is what finally forced them to put down the actual horsepower rating as it was in 1972 instead of as exaggerated before it was installed in the car with everything running on it.

Fantastic photos and info - thanks for posting

[Kavinsky]

and on the actual car they used 215/70/R15's on 15's (and I think possibly 235's in the rear towards the end of the cars run, before then the front and rear tires where the same pre popup headlamps) while the one on the vice car was 235/60/R14 all around on 14's150.5 millimeters in height of the tire with a half an inch radius wise extra height with 15 inch rims on the actual car, 15 inches to millimeters is 381coming out to a tire wheel height diameter of about 531.10 millimeters in Diameter, or 20.9 inches on the real daytona's with all around 215/70/R15 tires with 15 inch rims.with the vice car using the coding system of it being 60% of the tire width in height. it comes to about 141mm in height of the tire at half an inch smaller diameter of 14 14 inches to millimeters is 355.6355.6 + 141 = 506.6 mm, converted to inches that comes out to 19.9 inchesso literally the vice cars tires are an inch shorter than the actual cars, only because the rim is an inch smaller.so with the wider tires at lower tire height percentage the tires pretty much match the actual car in tire height with the 235/60's granted they are 20mm wider than the actual cars tires, but that makes me wonder if someone on the production crew did the math and it was a deliberate choice when getting the cars ready for the show. as the car had 195 either 60 or 70 R15's on it when it was made in 81' by markadian and mcburnie not 235/60's on it.So in Jurrasic's case with his car with its 215/60/R15's on 14'sto match the tire diameter height of the vice car at 19.9 inches (141 mm tire height, 5.5 inches with 235/60's)129mm in tire height (5 inches) with his on 14's, he would need to go with 215/65 tires which would come out to 139.75mm (5.49 inches) in tire height to fill the vertical gap between his wheel archesactually that could go for both Jurrassics and Sonny's car, Sonny's with the 215/60's in the front and Jurrassic with them all around.hmph never thought of bringing math into this but there it is, so literally to match the look of the actual car using the replicas 235/60's all you would need to do is literally go with 15 inch 60 spoke rims instead of the replica's 14' 72 spoke onesactually maybe I just figured out why the wire wheels seem deeper and darker on the actual car, less spokes, which might be what I like so much about the 16 inch one then:as that's a 60 spoke too, with either 205's, 215 or 225/60 R15's on ithttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7107&stc=1&d=1352416858I think there 225's, looks barely like two 2's and one 5 down there, really wish he had used a better camera.maybe to give it a slightly more european than american (namely low rider) look, lowriders usually have small wire wheels on small wheels with alot of spokes on them, usually they seem much tigher than the ones on the vice car:gotta wonder how the 12 spoke difference would fair thougheither that or the lowriders have either 18, 20, 22's or 24's on them (which reminds me of the Chris Rock bit on them) but incidentally a few auto manufacturers have been going for those rim sizes as of late

including lamborghini with the suv here

so its not a big deal but its the smallest of details that make the biggest of differences.There's another thing too, michelin tires have a very different profile from the Pirrellis

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=ee6Izc1y_-w

now from I think the daytona's time in 68 all the way until 1984 ferrari used Michelin tires on all of there cars:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoWm_P1D3Sc

[Kavinsky]

and starting with the testarossa and 328 in 1984 they started using Pirrellis, which gives that low down to the ground full tread look on the daytona you can see here at 0:54

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=4p4sno4MZ78

vs the actual daytona's sort of thin tire look with the michelin's

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGL0mO_xlDE

ditto with the C2 vettes 15's on 205/75/R15's

So maybe to make it more european and vintage looking use the michelens in the same tire size mixed in with 60 spoke 14 inch wire wheels, might help reduce the amount of polishing it needs too.either that or 215/65/R15'sjust for fun with the 225/60/R15's on 14 that comes out to with Brian's car vs the daytona141mm - 135 = 16mm tire height difference which comes out to half an inch lowerand the 205/75/R15's on 15's with the C2 vs the Vice Daytona's 20 inch diameter on 235/60/R15's on 14's comes out to 153.75mm tire height + rim diameter of 381 = 535.75mm total height diameter, 21 inches.vs the 21 inch tire diameter of the actual car and 20 of the vice car.so the C2 corvette was on par tire height wise with the Daytona back in the day, along with the chasis length, just with thinner tires because that's how they did things back then.while the daytona because of its further in axels probably lined up with it by accident with those 205's

[Youngman]

more tire infoSo When I was looking at the grill (see other post, other Daytona thread) I noticed the Tires are Pirelli P6 and 215/60 VR15 and 205/60 VR 15 and they are Cinturato. Hope that helps

[Kavinsky]

So When I was looking at the grill (see other post' date=' other Daytona thread) I noticed the Tires are Pirelli P6 and 215/60 VR15 and 205/60 VR 15 and they are Cinturato. Hope that helps[/quote']hmm so basically exactly the same brand and general idea as the ones on the show car, thanks.

[Kavinsky]

Hmm just doing some brainstorming here, turns out I had the gloss levels of paint a little bit mixed up.it goes matt, satin (which is matt with a very light gloss) semi gloss and then gloss.for whatever reason I thought matt and satin were the same thing and I'm starting to think that the same color differences we saw on 1980's cars and motorcyles are still around.just using either a semi gloss or satin black inplace of matt black to ease the contrast, the key thing that makes the biggest difference in the world when getting colors to look right next to each other. Which I said awhile ago on that thread to a guy about trying to vice his wardrobe.see here, a gloss midnight black motorcycle (I apologize in advance about the soundtrack) with satin black accents:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntckLon6Rc4

instead of straight matt like on the windshield trim of the post 78' carsit seems to blend better while not overpowering it like gloss here on this onehttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7177&stc=1&d=1353659211 allowing for a softer contrast yet still making the windshield trim seem smaller and separate from the car, basically allowing it to blend into the body with a higher reflection rate than straight matt and thus creating the softer contrast with a satin midnight black along with blacking out the chrome ontop and switching the sunvisor mounts for that of the pre 78 models. as it seems like putting the pivot point for the sunvisor there and having it fall down and all over the place might cause the owner to tweak the trim piece and pop the windshield trim on the front of the windshield out and out of whack. rather than the old system of just having it screwed into the inner windshield trim at two points with screws at a higher positon so it doesnt flap all over the place.The reason why that keeping it separate from the body thing is key is because the windshield of the C1 - C3 corvette was never ment to be a 100% flush with the body so putting it in a straight matching body color doesnt really suit ithttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7176&stc=1&d=1353659210http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7175&stc=1&d=1353659208FYI I came across that when I was looking for other cars painted midnight black on youtube like the vice car, not sure about the specifics other than its midnight black, has a blue tint in the light and I believe was an actual ferrari color

[Kavinsky]

Also its abit confusing as people have a hard time telling what matt black and satin black looks like, probably leading to my confusion.and I found the headlight example, it was in Australia of all places, it shows it at the end.

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx52Du1crqQ

also its kind of interesting to see the tirewall height difference between the 225/70's and the 215/70's here like on the actual car used on a 68 vette, the black one http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c3-general/2604040-225-70-15-mounted-pics.htmlamazing how much difference that 10mm thinner tread does to the sidewall height.and after watching this

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyGj9_zcNto

I gotta wonder how the astons glock black piano veneer would look on the stock center console of the daytona here:http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=5832&d=1335318476would it work as well as the burlwood?honestly I think that's maybe the only interesting thing that aston has going on there, I dont know the modern astons bore me truth be told. Kind of funny actually I'm starting to have a very anti car guy kind of mentality about modern sports cars in general actually. They just seem way too overblown from the James Bond thing, would rather have him in his 4 1/2 liter battleship grey blower bentley convertible than an modern aston actuallyhe'd atleast be able to drive someone off the road with a single bump and maybe it would scratch the chrome a touch but that would be about it, hell in casino royal he could have probably just pushed the thing back on its side like David Nivan did with his 3 1/2 back then in the 1940's after flipping it and just drive off.

[Matt5]

Really great - thanks for posting:D

[Kavinsky]

your welcome, it just helps to put things on paper and get a general idea of how things work.

[Matt5]

Brillant - great ideas here - thanks for info

[Kavinsky]

I think I may have stumbled upon two rules of the daytona replicas here, I was taking a look at this car from the front and the back herealong with this onehttp://corvette.canney.net/webvettes/customized/c0050/index.htmlboth are mcburnies.now on both cars the tires are the same size all the way around, the one with the 14's has atleast 235's all around minus the spinner capsthe 16 inch one from what I can tell has 225/60/R15's and take a look at the front wheel vs the rear, there looks like there's more flare covering the rear than the front, I dont know why but it seriously looks that way which might explain why I've always seemed to like the cars using a smaller tire in front like on these two:http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7306&stc=1&d=1355885195http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7307&stc=1&d=1355885198http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7308&stc=1&d=1355885199http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7309&stc=1&d=1355885201I really like this yellow one here, if only it didnt have the small headlight doors on it.where I think both the rowley is using a 225 in front and a 235 in the back and the mcburnie there is using 215's in the front and 235's in the back, both 60's and it even says so in the kitcar magazine therehttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7305&stc=1&d=1355885193except for the 60 bit there but I just get the feeling they are 60% of tire width there and oddly despite that fact the tires on the yellow one look congruent to me, like there the same distance from the end of the flarehence Brian's comment about the 235's seeming ballonish on all 4 wheels to him, and why he went with the 225's in the front and the 235's in the rear, I kind of see what he means there which might explain why even though now that I think the rims are too big on the 16' there I've always kind of liked it for some reasonand yet those two as well even though I'm much more a fan of 15's than 14 and why it seemed like I was picking up on something here from the back at this angle with the vice car and its all around 235's they might have tried to fill the flare in the rear and didnt notice that the flare was too small for it in the frontalso thought this was worth noting but atleast here it seems to sound like the Testarossa was cut of the same cloth in that regard:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testarossa225's in the front and 255's in the rear, at 50% sidewall height on themon the other hand it might also be the sidewall height too looking at this one, which has 245/40/17's on it, meaning the sidewall even though the tire is bigger is actually thinner:maybe that's part of it, maybe something like 235/50's would seem to blend into the body better to me, hell maybe that's why the Tires seem a little bit more TR like to me on this one too, its close to the tire height percentage of the TR.hmm maybe 60 - 70 is more like the old way the tires used to be rigged up on cars and 50 and below is closer to how its done now like on aston martins

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyGj9_zcNto

[Kavinsky]

Now for the second rule I think with the mirrors I'm starting to think the key with them is that they have to match whatever there closest too unless there chrome Like with Jurrasics here the mirrors work as there up and away from the gloss body and sitting right next to the matt windshield trim, meaning they match and the car looks great with them in that positionhttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7312&stc=1&d=1355886899but when there below here, right inbetween the dead space between the flares and the top of the door, which is why the square and cicular mirrors seem to work in that position, they spruce up a dead area between the top of the flare and the top of the bodyworkhttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7308&stc=1&d=1355885199it really seems like they need to be painted some sort of gloss as there sitting against the gloss body and the light is catching them at angles like that and its giving off a different level of light reflection, drawing your eyes to them instead of allowing them to blend inhttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7311&stc=1&d=1355886896http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7310&stc=1&d=1355886894http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7313&stc=1&d=1355887123http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7314&stc=1&d=1355887125as even on that yellow one the mirrors while there black there gloss black so while there a different color from the body it still reflects on the same level as the body, hell might be possibile just to gloss coat them to keep the original look but get the wave length the same so it blends in better when the iris receives the light level being reflected off of the body.

[Kavinsky]

I had some success here finding out what the mirrors of these two might be, that 308 and that rowley from europehttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7342&stc=1&d=1356124151http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7340&stc=1&d=1356124147http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7341&stc=1&d=1356124149So I took a page out of the miura guys book from the lambo miura site when looking for mirrors as with lamborghini just like ferrari the second it has that name attached to it even if its a normal part that was used on alot of cars it jumps astronomically in price, which is what happened with the tail lights of a rare lambo miura roadsterhttp://www.lambomiura.com/info/Roadster/roadster.htmatleast it used to say he wanted something like 5 grand for miura tail lights when they were 150 and off of a fiatso I put in fiat mirrors as ferrari is owned by fiat and has been since 1973, just as the 308 came online and even 308 owners try and use this trick and others to get cheaper parts, one resorting to volkswaggen mirrors instead of paying $250 for a set of turbo mirrors like thishttp://www.ebay.com/itm/EMPI-4590-VW-BUG-BUGGY-MINI-SPYDER-MIRRORS-/120443648445?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c0b0039bd&vxp=mtrhttp://www.ebay.com/itm/Vitaloni-Baby-Turbo-Rearview-Mirror-Left-Side-OEM-Ferrari-Alfa-Romeo-Lancia-/221168994230?hash=item337eb307b6&item=221168994230&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtrfrom a ferrari parts manufacturer, ecklers I believe he said, yeah 250 for a set instead of 40 bucks and selected used otherwise you get like a billion other hits on ebay from new part manufactures who falsley flag the stuff as being for X car that's also brand new.and it looks like the mirrors of the 308 there are off of a fiat 850 or another fiat:http://www.ebay.com/itm/71-FIAT-850-SIDE-VIEW-MIRROR-DOOR-SPIDER-CONVERTIBLE-VINTAGE-OLD-1-/190717472997?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c67a5b0e5&vxp=mtrhttp://www.ebay.com/itm/FIAT-124-SPIDER-1800-2000-door-LH-driver-MIRROR-simpa-/261042896976?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cc75e8050&vxp=mtrthe mirror of the chrome one is a geniune mirror off of a dino 308 from the early 70's when chrome mirrors were still in style:sorry can see it here much betterhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/mauboi/4682705644/also note the odd 911 in gulf colors, make of that what you may.http://www.ebay.com/itm/ferrari-DINO-308-GT4-RARE-CROMODORA-ASTRO-III-MIRROR-SUPER-CLEAN-buy-it-now-/170959795279?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AFerrari&hash=item27cdff744f&vxp=mtrI have seen that 308 in person along with the real 308, that one is as odd looking as it looks, showed up at the shotgun range once and I had a word with the owner about it, actually he lives up the street from me apparently as I have seen it parked there once in the summertime in a blue moon.anyways chrome never goes out of style but they wanted to try something different back then as it had always been chrome since the beginning of automotive history in the 1900's back then, hence why everything started to go body colored or matt black.and the reason why I've been looking so hard for this is because well I dont like the lip the full size tornado mirrors have on themhttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7313&stc=1&d=1355887123 and I prefer how swept back the mirrors of that 308 there, the top one to them and chances are they're probably paintable like the tornado ones are as well. while ironically on the baby tornado mirrors it looks as if the lip is for the most part gone, like it only effects the metal large ones that droop more in hot weather. Also thought this was worth bringing up but there is another new process being done to better protect car bodies now called of all things glass coating, like what they do for custom rifles of all things where the stock is glass coated to better freefloat the barrel to make it more accurate. where its like a hard film that goes over the entire body to protect it, keep its polished look and its supposed to last 7 yearsits a volkswaggen thing but its contracted by them by some other company, I forget the name but the guy who has a tiguan around here was telling me about it and hell even after getting his car covered in salt a few times along with just in general dirty even after coming out of the car wash the car looks pretty much brand new. and none of that dried rain circle thing on it either, looks as good as the day it was new which might make it a hell of its not scrach proof he told me but it should better protect the body underneath it, better than bare skining it like it normally is.had some sort of surface scrach he put in by accident on the hood he said, bodyshop took it out, could have been a surface scratch only in the film though.maybe that mixed in with a vlynl wrap or seethrough plastic wrap like porsche was experementing with would be the ideal way to protect a nice car from people with suv's and minivans that have high doors because of there high roofline where even accidentally and not intententionally they can leave a scrach or ding on a low car next to themhence why you try and park next to a car with an equally high roofline to prevent dings and scraches next to putting as much space between them and you as possibile

[Kavinsky]

Hmm you know I was looking at the photos of the dashes here and I think the way to make the replica daytona dash ones look more professional is to bring up the window tint like on the volo museum car herehttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7494&stc=1&d=1359526627where you can see that the tint line has been brought up to hide the inside corners of the bodywork from view, namely in the corners around where the hood meets with the quarter panelshttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7495&stc=1&d=1359526629and I gotta admit after seeing this:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-eGL5J1FAw

part of me is wondering how a mcburnie would look with the windshield of this not so pretty TR7

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSJpaKQW5Jo

as it seems like while the replicas have the height and look of the windshield down from the sideshttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7497&stc=1&d=1359527329it seems rather flat from the front and would look nicer if the windshield had more of an extended curvature to ithttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7496&stc=1&d=1359527327although I cant imagine the TR7 one without a matt black or satin black paint job to it given its still disconnected from the sides of the body, ditto with the chromeeither that or

[Kavinsky]

what about removing the external windshield trim all together like herehttp://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7498&stc=1&d=1359527784http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7499&stc=1&d=1359527787http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7500&stc=1&d=1359527789http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7501&stc=1&d=1359527791http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7502&stc=1&d=1359527793to try and make it as low profile as possibile and then black out the chrome on the top, as you can just see it sticking out from the top with the trim gone:http://www.miamiviceonline.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7503&stc=1&d=1359527836not sure about the weather stripping though, but if all it is is trim and nothing else it could be left off or had some sort of very thin fiberglass part made for it.