The Ferrari Daytonas of Miami Vice

[jurassic narc]

I'm a bit confused. I know that in this thread as well as in the Car Chasers' thread there were comments by yourself and CameraDaytona that CameraDaytona inspected the Volo car and said the VIN number of that car did not match Universal Studios records of the 2 Vice Cars. 

Here's the post in the Car Chasers thread:

 

So how is it now possible that the VIN number does match if it was previously confirmed otherwise?

Every car has a public VIN which is required by law to be readable through the windshield, and a confidential number (sometimes several sets) hidden a location generally known to law enforcement and insurance companies.  Over the years the location of those numbers has become known to the general public.  Volo was able to locate the frame number of the car, and it is in fact the number of car #1.  It appears that someone altered the public number (which on cars of that vintage is relatively simple).  I was very skeptical, but I have seen photos of the frame number, and the fact that the dash or public plate is in the hands of someone else doesn't change the facts that the car Volo has is in fact the Stunt Car.

[Sonny-Burnett]

Every car has a public VIN which is required by law to be readable through the windshield, and a confidential number (sometimes several sets) hidden a location generally known to law enforcement and insurance companies.  Over the years the location of those numbers has become known to the general public.  Volo was able to locate the frame number of the car, and it is in fact the number of car #1.  It appears that someone altered the public number (which on cars of that vintage is relatively simple).  I was very skeptical, but I have seen photos of the frame number, and the fact that the dash or public plate is in the hands of someone else doesn't change the facts that the car Volo has is in fact the Stunt Car.

 

Hmm skeptical is the right word for sure, considering all the past discussions we've had on the Volo car.

So the public number of the VIN on the Volo car you are referring to was behind the windshield? I would have assumed that VIN number would not exist in that location because of the customized nature of the replacement dash assembly.

I had heard about (but do not know the specifics) of hidden locations used by Law Enforcement for tracing stolen vehicles, but I also assumed that you would have made CameraDaytona aware of such locations prior to his visit to Volo some time ago, so he could check the VIN numbers in those locations for getting the proper match?

Can you describe the locations of the VIN numbers that CameraDaytona used for inspection some time ago (seemingly altered) , and the latest location that now does appear to match?

Also puzzled by why someone would alter the VIN on the standalone chassis/frame, unless it had something to do with retitling the car?

Edited April 28, 2015 by Sonny-Burnett

[volobrian]

Car #1 was sold by Universal without a title.  An unethical way to get a title that cuts through the red tape is to drill out the vin tag and replace it with one that has a title.  After noticing the rivets were not factory GM rivets this raised questions which sparked a full investigation.  The confidential frame numbers are only visible by removing the body or cutting an access hole, something CameraDaytona didn't have access to when viewing the car.  After cutting open an access hole and finding the frame VIN numbers, it was discovered it was a 1976 VIN.  The VIN # was sent for comparison against the the Universal documents and confirmed to be the correct numbers by Jurassic Narc and CameraDaytona.  (the frame VIN is actually stamped into the frame) Furthering the investigation, the visible pillar tag calls for a 1980 body, the body is also a 1976, there are many differences between the 2 bodies, proving the visible VIN tag does not belong to the body.  Corvette bodies also came with a trim tag which designates the color codes and a build date.  The codes determined the body is a 1976 body built in the 3rd week of March.  The sequential numbers on the frame also determine the frame to be built the 3rd week of March making the frame and body a perfect match.  The body itself also tells a story, both the frame and fiberglass are shorter by 1 1/4 inches, the filled in holes exist from the misplaced nose emblem, there are holes cut in the doors for speakers (the #1 car has speakers in the door panels)  The black and white photo of the original build of the #1 car shows it to be a dark color, this car was originally dark green, the rear marker lights were patched and filled with evidence on the backside of the body, there is an abandoned brake line as evidence of the now removed stunt brake, there are remains of skid plates and other rigging on the frame, the Daytona body has evidence of red paint, the #1 car was originally red. 

[Sonny-Burnett]

Car #1 was sold by Universal without a title.  An unethical way to get a title that cuts through the red tape is to drill out the vin tag and replace it with one that has a title.  After noticing the rivets were not factory GM rivets this raised questions which sparked a full investigation.  The confidential frame numbers are only visible by removing the body or cutting an access hole, something CameraDaytona didn't have access to when viewing the car.  After cutting open an access hole and finding the frame VIN numbers, it was discovered it was a 1976 VIN.  The VIN # was sent for comparison against the the Universal documents and confirmed to be the correct numbers by Jurassic Narc and CameraDaytona.  (the frame VIN is actually stamped into the frame) Furthering the investigation, the visible pillar tag calls for a 1980 body, the body is also a 1976, there are many differences between the 2 bodies, proving the visible VIN tag does not belong to the body.  Corvette bodies also came with a trim tag which designates the color codes and a build date.  The codes determined the body is a 1976 body built in the 3rd week of March.  The sequential numbers on the frame also determine the frame to be built the 3rd week of March making the frame and body a perfect match.  The body itself also tells a story, both the frame and fiberglass are shorter by 1 1/4 inches, the filled in holes exist from the misplaced nose emblem, there are holes cut in the doors for speakers (the #1 car has speakers in the door panels)  The black and white photo of the original build of the #1 car shows it to be a dark color, this car was originally dark green, the rear marker lights were patched and filled with evidence on the backside of the body, there is an abandoned brake line as evidence of the now removed stunt brake, there are remains of skid plates and other rigging on the frame, the Daytona body has evidence of red paint, the #1 car was originally red. 

 

Hi Brian and welcome to the forum!

I understand you are affiliated with Volo museum up north. I am familiar with the museum from years ago when I lived in the Far North burbs, but now I am much further south and I have yet to see the Daytona in your shop. I too am a Daytona owner, though my McBurnie was one of the later ones made.  This is indeed very unexpected and surprising news about Car 1, and it is exciting to those of us who love the Miami Vice Daytonas.

Thanks for your detailed description of the VIN discovery and research. Btw, how did you know where to look for the hidden VIN numbers?

 

We had numerous discussions in here in the past about Car # 1 and the consensus was that the body had likely been removed from the chassis, and the chassis/frame likely scrapped in Roberts' shop. As the Daytona body had no identifying codes there was a strong likelihood it would never be identified or located. But that the length of the right side on your car is 1.25 inches shorter than the left matched up with comments from McBurnie did indicate to some in here that you may have the Car 1 body. But to learn of the frame discovery is big news.

 

the visible pillar tag calls for a 1980 body, the body is also a 1976, there are many differences between the 2 bodies, proving the visible VIN tag does not belong to the body.  Corvette bodies also came with a trim tag which designates the color codes and a build date.  The codes determined the body is a 1976 body built in the 3rd week of March.  The sequential numbers on the frame also determine the frame to be built the 3rd week of March making the frame and body a perfect match.

 

 

 

On your note above, I'm not sure I'm following your comment about "the body is also a 1976", as there would be no code on the Daytona molds, or the comment "there are many differences between the 2 bodies, proving the visible VIN tag does not belong to the body.  Corvette bodies also came with a trim tag which designates the color codes and a build date.  The codes determined the body is a 1976 body built in the 3rd week of March. " --- I'm not sure what Corvette body you would have, or where you would get the body trim tag for this specific frame, as I think you only have the frame's VIN code to work with?

In any case you would be able to obtain and compare specs on a 1980 Vette body to see whether it would even fit on a 1976 frame.

 

Again, welcome and we look forward to your further comments.

[Pritt]

Interessting. Thanks for all this surprising informations.

 

What are we doing now with our pal Jeff Sauter. It was Jeff who found the Volo-Daytona in the sun of Lubbock. And it was him, who found the car chasers Daytona with the correct body length, which one has confirmed by Tom McBurnie? But, there can only be one car # 1.

 

Brian, what do you think?

Edited April 28, 2015 by Pritt

[COOPER&BURNETT]

Perhaps McBurnie was mistaken about the Car Chasers Daytona, and might want to re-confirm which car is the #1 car based on this new evidence. 

[volobrian]

Hi Brian and welcome to the forum!

I understand you are affiliated with Volo museum up north. I am familiar with the museum from years ago when I lived in the Far North burbs, but now I am much further south and I have yet to see the Daytona in your shop. I too am a Daytona owner, though my McBurnie was one of the later ones made.  This is indeed very unexpected and surprising news about Car 1, and it is exciting to those of us who love the Miami Vice Daytonas.

Thanks for your detailed description of the VIN discovery and research. Btw, how did you know where to look for the hidden VIN numbers?

 

We had numerous discussions in here in the past about Car # 1 and the consensus was that the body had likely been removed from the chassis, and the chassis/frame likely scrapped in Roberts' shop. As the Daytona body had no identifying codes there was a strong likelihood it would never be identified or located. But that the length of the right side on your car is 1.25 inches shorter than the left matched up with comments from McBurnie did indicate to some in here that you may have the Car 1 body. But to learn of the frame discovery is big news.

 

 

On your note above, I'm not sure I'm following your comment about "the body is also a 1976", as there would be no code on the Daytona molds, or the comment "there are many differences between the 2 bodies, proving the visible VIN tag does not belong to the body.  Corvette bodies also came with a trim tag which designates the color codes and a build date.  The codes determined the body is a 1976 body built in the 3rd week of March. " --- I'm not sure what Corvette body you would have, or where you would get the body trim tag for this specific frame, as I think you only have the frame's VIN code to work with?

In any case you would be able to obtain and compare specs on a 1980 Vette body to see whether it would even fit on a 1976 frame.

 

Again, welcome and we look forward to your further comments.

 

Thanks for the welcome.  Of course there is much more research that went into the car than whats summerised here.  A very detailed summery with photos have been sent to CameraDaytona and Jurassic Narc with all of the finds. To answer your question, when McBurnie would convert the Corvette into a Daytona, only the outter skins were replaced, the main structure of the car is still the original 1976 Corvette.  The VIN that is on the pillar is for a 1980 Corvette.  There are differences between the 2 years; one example, the location of the interior door handles are different. The location of the door handles suggests its a 1976 door and not a 1980 door.  The biggest piece of proof though is the cars trim tag which is affixed to the Corvettes main body structure and would not need to be removed or modified for the Daytona conversion.  The information provided on that tag is the exterior and interior colors as well as a date code.  The paint codes are 1976 Corvette paint codes, which tells us that the Corvette structure is a 1976.  The date code on the tag tells us it was built 3rd week of March.  (as a side note, the trim tag calls for green paint, black interior, traces of the original green paint still exisit on the car.  When the 1980 serial number was ran, it came back to a beige car, proving the trim tag is original to the car and not the VIN tag).  So from this info we know the donor body is a green, black interior 1976 Corvette built the 3rd week of March.   Now the frame has the actual VIN (which matches the documentation).  NCRS has a calendar that shows what Corvette VIN's were built and when.  The frame was also built the 3rd week in March.  So now we know that the frame and body were built at the same time.  Which tells us that both the body and chassis are from the #1 car.   Its my opinion that while Roberts did modify the car, he had never dismantled the body from the frame, looking at the frame and body mounts, they do not look like they had ever been apart. 

[volobrian]

Interessting. Thanks for all this surprising informations.

 

What are we doing now with our pal Jeff Sauter. It was Jeff who found the Volo-Daytona in the sun of Lubbock. And it was him, who found the car chasers Daytona with the correct body length, which one has confirmed by Tom McBurnie? But, there can only be one car # 1.

 

Brian, what do you think?

Jeff and I are aquaintences and I will not say anything bad about him or his car.  Talking to him he really believes his car is the #1 car.  Whether or not his mind has changed with all the new evidence and confirmation of the VIN on this car, I couldn't tell you. 

[Kavinsky]

hmm what's going on here, did I miss something?

 

yeash I take a break for a few days and the world explodes lol

[Sonny-Burnett]

Thanks for the welcome.  Of course there is much more research that went into the car than whats summerised here.  A very detailed summery with photos have been sent to CameraDaytona and Jurassic Narc with all of the finds. To answer your question, when McBurnie would convert the Corvette into a Daytona, only the outter skins were replaced, the main structure of the car is still the original 1976 Corvette.  The VIN that is on the pillar is for a 1980 Corvette.  There are differences between the 2 years; one example, the location of the interior door handles are different. The location of the door handles suggests its a 1976 door and not a 1980 door.  The biggest piece of proof though is the cars trim tag which is affixed to the Corvettes main body structure and would not need to be removed or modified for the Daytona conversion.  The information provided on that tag is the exterior and interior colors as well as a date code.  The paint codes are 1976 Corvette paint codes, which tells us that the Corvette structure is a 1976.  The date code on the tag tells us it was built 3rd week of March.  (as a side note, the trim tag calls for green paint, black interior, traces of the original green paint still exisit on the car.  When the 1980 serial number was ran, it came back to a beige car, proving the trim tag is original to the car and not the VIN tag).  So from this info we know the donor body is a green, black interior 1976 Corvette built the 3rd week of March.   Now the frame has the actual VIN (which matches the documentation).  NCRS has a calendar that shows what Corvette VIN's were built and when.  The frame was also built the 3rd week in March.  So now we know that the frame and body were built at the same time.  Which tells us that both the body and chassis are from the #1 car.   Its my opinion that while Roberts did modify the car, he had never dismantled the body from the frame, looking at the frame and body mounts, they do not look like they had ever been apart. 

 

Interesting that after all our speculating in here that the Car #1 body and frame had been separated, with the frame lost, that it now appears that the body was never removed from the frame.

Thanks again Brian for sharing further details with us. I understand now your references to the body trim tag, and cross referencing it to the VIN date codes.  Sounds to me to be the real deal, and my congrats to you.

I'm looking forward to making the drive north to have a look at Car # 1, and I'll be sure and look you up when I do.

Please do keep us posted as to any plans you may have for the car in the future, and we'd all love to see any before and after photos of your restoration work details you might care to share in here with us.

[volobrian]

Thanks Sonny! The real congrats goes to the Miami Vice fans, this piece of history was almost lost but now after what, 25 years? It's disguise is off! And it will be preserved for the enjoyment of generations to come.

[Mvice8489]

Brian-

 

I am confused as to why this information is just now being discovered.  You guys have had the car for years.  How was this info not relayed to the public much earlier?    I actually spoke with you on the phone about buying this car back in August 2013 and you were kind enough to give me 4 passes to your museum so that my family and I could drive from Milwaukee to see it in person.   If this info would have been made available I would have made you an offer.   So is the car still "for sale" ?? 

[volobrian]

The cars not for sale. We've never been active in our efforts of trying to actually sell it. As for the information that was just posted, we just discovered all of this this weekend and were able to confirm it against CameraDaytonas paperwork. Since it was said that the car was dismantled and the frame salvaged, we never thought of checking the frame numbers. Once I discovered the pillar vin tag was replaced, that's what promted me to check the frame #. After tossing aside everything I thought to be true about the history of the #1 car the research became easy and I let the car tell the story. People lie, evidence doesn't.

[volobrian]

The cars not for sale. We've never been active in our efforts of trying to actually sell it. As for the information that was just posted, we just discovered all of this this weekend and were able to confirm it against CameraDaytonas paperwork. Since it was said that the car was dismantled and the frame salvaged, we never thought of checking the frame numbers. Once I discovered the pillar vin tag was replaced, that's what promted me to check the frame #. After tossing aside everything I thought to be true about the history of the #1 car the research became easy and I let the car tell the story. People lie, evidence doesn't.

[Pritt]

 

Interesting that after all our speculating in here that the Car #1 body and frame had been separated, with the frame lost, that it now appears that the body was never removed from the frame.

Thanks again Brian for sharing further details with us. I understand now your references to the body trim tag, and cross referencing it to the VIN date codes.  Sounds to me to be the real deal, and my congrats to you.

 

Please do keep us posted as to any plans you may have for the car in the future, and we'd all love to see any before and after photos of your restoration work details you might care to share in here with us.

That's exactly what I want to say. Unfortunately, my English is not good enough so i made a copy of S-B' words.

 

Welcome to the forum Brian.

 

I ask me, who rebuild the dash. It has to be before they used the car for Speedzone.

Edited April 29, 2015 by Pritt

[volobrian]

Thanks Pritt. The car had lots of modifications done to it before Speed Zone. In time we will be changing it all back to how it was in the show.

[jurassic narc]

Car #1 was sold by Universal without a title.  An unethical way to get a title that cuts through the red tape is to drill out the vin tag and replace it with one that has a title.  After noticing the rivets were not factory GM rivets this raised questions which sparked a full investigation.  The confidential frame numbers are only visible by removing the body or cutting an access hole, something CameraDaytona didn't have access to when viewing the car.  After cutting open an access hole and finding the frame VIN numbers, it was discovered it was a 1976 VIN.  The VIN # was sent for comparison against the the Universal documents and confirmed to be the correct numbers by Jurassic Narc and CameraDaytona.  (the frame VIN is actually stamped into the frame) Furthering the investigation, the visible pillar tag calls for a 1980 body, the body is also a 1976, there are many differences between the 2 bodies, proving the visible VIN tag does not belong to the body.  Corvette bodies also came with a trim tag which designates the color codes and a build date.  The codes determined the body is a 1976 body built in the 3rd week of March.  The sequential numbers on the frame also determine the frame to be built the 3rd week of March making the frame and body a perfect match.  The body itself also tells a story, both the frame and fiberglass are shorter by 1 1/4 inches, the filled in holes exist from the misplaced nose emblem, there are holes cut in the doors for speakers (the #1 car has speakers in the door panels)  The black and white photo of the original build of the #1 car shows it to be a dark color, this car was originally dark green, the rear marker lights were patched and filled with evidence on the backside of the body, there is an abandoned brake line as evidence of the now removed stunt brake, there are remains of skid plates and other rigging on the frame, the Daytona body has evidence of red paint, the #1 car was originally red.

Neither car had an original title. Universal bought them from Mardikian in the fall of 86 or the winter of 87 when it became obvious that the show would continue. Mardikian had lost the titles to the EPA when they searched his office. Since the cars were in Florida, California would not issue replacement titles. Ultimately, one of the Metro-Dade SWAT officers who worked on the show as a consultant was able to certify that the cars did exist and California issued replacement titles. The titles had the correct VIN numbers, but the wrong year models (redacted copies are posted on the site somewhere). Carl Roberts got the cars from Universal, but only got a title for the Camera Car (which may beg the question, did he really get both cars, or just end up with both cars?). When Carl sent the cars to Canada for SpeedZone, he couldn't cross the border with a car with no title. I am guessing that precipitated the number change. And since that is a felony, that would explain why I was told a long story about changing bodies and other tall tales.

And I checked my car and the color/trim tag is also in tact in my car. Everything seems to be falling into place.

So, (with all this excitement about the cars) if you are interested in a fully functional Miami Vice Daytona, give me a shout.

[jurassic narc]

Perhaps McBurnie was mistaken about the Car Chasers Daytona, and might want to re-confirm which car is the #1 car based on this new evidence. 

The numbers don't lie. The Volo car has the serial number of the Stunt Car as described in paperwork from Universal contemporary to the show. The Camera Car has the other serial number in the same documentation. That solves the issue as far as I am concerned. In the past Camera Daytona and I have held fast that the car numbers don't lie. Finding the hidden frame number solves the mystery. And I have cut out trunk and floor pans in the past to find hidden VIN numbers in criminal cases. Everything in this chain of events seems to fit the ultimate truth of things.

[Sonny-Burnett]

Neither car had an original title. Universal bought them from Mardikian in the fall of 86 or the winter of 87 when it became obvious that the show would continue. Mardikian had lost the titles to the EPA when they searched his office. Since the cars were in Florida, California would not issue replacement titles. Ultimately, one of the Metro-Dade SWAT officers who worked on the show as a consultant was able to certify that the cars did exist and California issued replacement titles. The titles had the correct VIN numbers, but the wrong year models (redacted copies are posted on the site somewhere). Carl Roberts got the cars from Universal, but only got a title for the Camera Car (which may beg the question, did he really get both cars, or just end up with both cars?). When Carl sent the cars to Canada for SpeedZone, he couldn't cross the border with a car with no title. I am guessing that precipitated the number change. And since that is a felony, that would explain why I was told a long story about changing bodies and other tall tales.

And I checked my car and the color/trim tag is also in tact in my car. Everything seems to be falling into place.

So, (with all this excitement about the cars) if you are interested in a fully functional Miami Vice Daytona, give me a shout.

 

JN, I had the same thought after reading Brian's notes yesterday and speaking with him. However, didn't we previously discuss somewhere in here that the 2 Speed Zone cars were not used in Vice? I thought there were 2 other cars sitting somewhere in Texas that you alluded to in the Car Chasers thread that were independent of the 2 Vice cars. And that one of them may now be in Sauter's possession.

So if there were 2 other cars really used in Speed Zone, perhaps Roberts or Sauter conflated/mixed up some of the paperwork that ended up passing with the Car that we now know as Car #1 in Volo, such that the Volo car may not have been used in SpeedZone at all?

Edited April 29, 2015 by Sonny-Burnett

[Sonny-Burnett]

The numbers don't lie. The Volo car has the serial number of the Stunt Car as described in paperwork from Universal contemporary to the show. The Camera Car has the other serial number in the same documentation. That solves the issue as far as I am concerned. In the past Camera Daytona and I have held fast that the car numbers don't lie. Finding the hidden frame number solves the mystery. And I have cut out trunk and floor pans in the past to find hidden VIN numbers in criminal cases. Everything in this chain of events seems to fit the ultimate truth of things.

 

Agree 100%. I think it is case closed now that you have validated the VIN number of the Volo car to be that of Car #1, the Stunt Daytona.

[volobrian]

JN, I had the same thought after reading Brian's notes yesterday and speaking with him. However, didn't we previously discuss somewhere in here that the 2 Speed Zone cars were not used in Vice? I thought there were 2 other cars sitting somewhere in Texas that you alluded to in the Car Chasers thread that were independent of the 2 Vice cars. And that one of them may now be in Sauter's possession.

So if there were 2 other cars really used in Speed Zone, perhaps Roberts or Sauter conflated/mixed up some of the paperwork that ended up passing with the Car that we now know as Car #1 in Volo, such that the Volo car may not have been used in SpeedZone at all?

I have a ton of paperwork for this car from Carl Robets Motors that reflects the incorrect 1980 VIN that suggests it was used in Speed Zone.   Mainly the shipping documents, which ironically refer to the car as Miami Vice Car.  Plus if you look at Speed Zone you can see unique features, like the exhaust on our car and the Speed Zone car are the same.  We have made some corrections when we had it painted to make it more "Miami Viceish", Roberts changed the door handles and a few other things.  Which I now notice there are more items to change like reinstalling side marker lights and removing the large trunk Ferrari horse.   And just as a side note, what I believe to have happened, Roberts said he tried to use the Car 1 frame for the Testarossa Stunt car but it didn't work.  I don't think the body or frame were ever seperated as there are no signs of it coming apart.  I think Roberts bought a 1980 Corvette and tried to use that frame for the stunt car and then used the VIN and title for Car #1.  After all, being a non-street legal stunt car, he would have needed a title for the Stunt-Rossa. 

[Sonny-Burnett]

I have a ton of paperwork for this car from Carl Robets Motors that reflects the incorrect 1980 VIN that suggests it was used in Speed Zone.   Mainly the shipping documents, which ironically refer to the car as Miami Vice Car.  Plus if you look at Speed Zone you can see unique features, like the exhaust on our car and the Speed Zone car are the same.  We have made some corrections when we had it painted to make it more "Miami Viceish", Roberts changed the door handles and a few other things.  Which I now notice there are more items to change like reinstalling side marker lights and removing the large trunk Ferrari horse.   And just as a side note, what I believe to have happened, Roberts said he tried to use the Car 1 frame for the Testarossa Stunt car but it didn't work.  I don't think the body or frame were ever seperated as there are no signs of it coming apart.  I think Roberts bought a 1980 Corvette and tried to use that frame for the stunt car and then used the VIN and title for Car #1.  After all, being a non-street legal stunt car, he would have needed a title for the Stunt-Rossa. 

 

Thanks Brian. Do your shipping docs reference your non-original (from the '80 Vette)  VIN number of your car? Do your shipping docs also reference the other VIN number for the second Daytona shipped as well? If your car was also used in SpeedZone, then I'm wondering which other car was sent with yours.

On the Stunt Testa, I thought we had documented somewhere in here that a DeTomaso Pantera frame was used for the Stunt Testarossa.

It certainly seems likely that Roberts must have obtained an '80 Vette from somewhere and used the VIN and Title for your car. Perhaps he tried using the '80 Vette frame and it would not work, because of the larger Testa body panels. and then ended up with the Pantera.

Edited April 29, 2015 by Sonny-Burnett

[volobrian]

Thanks Brian. Do your shipping docs reference your non-original (from the '80 Vette)  VIN number of your car? Do your shipping docs also reference the other VIN number for the second Daytona shipped as well? If your car was also used in SpeedZone, then I'm wondering which other car was sent with yours.

On the Stunt Testa, I thought we had documented somewhere in here that a DeTomaso Pantera frame was used for the Stunt Testarossa.

It certainly seems likely that Roberts must have obtained an '80 Vette from somewhere and used the VIN and Title for your car. Perhaps he tried using the '80 Vette frame and it would not work, because of the larger Testa body panels. and then ended up with the Pantera.

The shipping docs list the 1980 VIN and the VIN to the other car.  So the other Speed Zone car can be documented.  Story has it that Roberts tried to use the Car 1 Chassis for the stunt Testarossa but it didn't work because of the mid-engine of the Ferrari. So he scrapped the frame (or dissappeared in some other fashion) and then he used the Pantera.  Which is why I am guessing it was the frame to the 1980 VIN tag I have.

[Sonny-Burnett]

The shipping docs list the 1980 VIN and the VIN to the other car.  So the other Speed Zone car can be documented.  Story has it that Roberts tried to use the Car 1 Chassis for the stunt Testarossa but it didn't work because of the mid-engine of the Ferrari. So he scrapped the frame (or dissappeared in some other fashion) and then he used the Pantera.  Which is why I am guessing it was the frame to the 1980 VIN tag I have.

 

Yep, that also now makes sense and dovetails with the version that I believe JN mentioned...namely that the Car 1 frame was eventually scrapped by Roberts. In reality Roberts must have scrapped the '80 Vette's frame and the Title and VIN for that car found its way over to yours.

I think you're also right about the mid-engine issue on the Testa, vs the body panels.

And if Roberts never removed the body panels from your car's frame, he must then have been trying to use the frame on the '80 Vette for the Stunt Testa.

So I'm wondering who might have the other car sent up for Speed Zone. I assume you ran that VIN number past CameraDaytona to see if his car was ever sent North? Or could this be the car that Car Chasers is holding?

Edited April 29, 2015 by Sonny-Burnett

[volobrian]

Yep, that also now makes sense and dovetails with the version that I believe JN mentioned...namely that the Car 1 frame was eventually scrapped by Roberts. In reality Roberts must have scrapped the '80 Vette's frame and the Title and VIN for that car found its way over to yours.

I think you're also right about the mid-engine issue on the Testa, vs the body panels.

And if Roberts never removed the body panels from your car's frame, he must then have been trying to use the frame on the '80 Vette for the Stunt Testa.

So I'm wondering who might have the other car sent up for Speed Zone. I assume you ran that VIN number past CameraDaytona to see if his car was ever sent North? Or could this be the car that Car Chasers is holding?

CameraDaytona's car was sold prior to Speed Zone, plus the VIN for the Speed Zone 2 car seems like its an assigned VIN, which happens a lot with Kit cars as it is not a Corvette serial number.  I do not know the serial # to Jeff's Daytona but I am guessing the car he has is the other Speed Zone car.  And I am guessing it is the one that was driven down the stairs and other stunts.  When you watch Speed Zone, its hard to tell, but it looks like the 2 cars have different wheels, the MV car has the yellow stickers on the center of the spinners but other times it looks like all chrome spinners, like Jeffs car.  But again, thats just my guess work with no real evidence.